Viktor Orbán speaks inconvenient truth: ‘Russia cannot be defeated because it is a nuclear power’

Why can’t the neocons in Washington understand they are dealing, not with Saddam Hussein or Muammar Gaddafi, but with a nuclear superpower?

If the U.S./NATO-backed Ukrainian counter-offensive were to prove successful in retaking certain Russian territories, Russia would be forced to use nuclear weapons.

This was the message of Dmitry Medvedev, deputy chairman of the Russian Security Council.

“If we imagine that the Ukrainian offensive with NATO support was successful and they took part of our territory, we would have to resort to the use of nuclear weapons under the rules of the decree of the Russian President of 2 June 2020,” the former president said on his Telegram channel.

Medvedev was likely referring to the 2020 Russian nuclear doctrine, which states that in case of an attack with conventional weapons that threaten the existence of the Russian nation, nuclear weapons could be used to stop the attack.

The latest warning comes after drone attacks on Moscow over the weekend. And on Sunday, the day after a major drone attack on Moscow’s financial district, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said he’s ready to “return” the war to Russia’s own territory.

Hungary’s prime minister, Viktor Orbán, is also trying to explain what’s at stake to his fellow NATO allies. Watch 2-minute video below.

Orbán believes Russia, as a nuclear power, cannot be defeated and warns against the consequences of continuing the war in Ukraine. He stresses the need for peace to prevent further losses of life, mostly Ukrainian lives.

The fact that nobody in Washington is thinking along these lines or seems to recognize the obvious, is frightening.

Because he speaks out about what should be obvious truths, CNN and the Western neocon politicians want you to think Orbán is “a threat to the international order.”

If the liberal international order being upheld by the U.S. and NATO is one based on moral chaos and a constant threat of war, maybe Orbán should be seen as a threat. He tends to be the only adult in the room whenever these NATO countries get together to hash out world affairs, and now the E.U. Advisory Committee wants to exclude Hungary from the E.U. presidency. The committee cited Hungary’s “democratic deficit” as its primary reason for trying to block the presidency. Yeah, right. We know the real reason is that Hungary is not thirsty enough for Russian blood like the rest of the Euro-Atlantic neocon warmongers.

These Western warmongers will never understand this simple fact: You don’t pick a fight with a nuclear power and expect to achieve a regime change, which Lindsey Graham and many other American neocon politicians have admitted is the U.S. goal in sending endless weaponry to Ukraine. They say they want to degrade Russian power and this would require replacing Putin with another World Economic Forum puppet like themselves, who will join them in their “net zero” carbon foolishness.

In the absence of a peace deal, the only one whose power is being degraded is that of the United States of America and NATO. We are the ones who, through the policies of our corrupt globalist stooges in high elected office, have over the last 35 years been outsourcing our industrial base to China, to the point where we cannot survive a war with Russia and China because those two countries not only have massive nuclear and conventional capabilities but they also out-perform us on an industrial level. That means in any protracted war, we would run out of munitions before they would. This is why I suspect, based on the actions of the Western NATO countries I have seen over the last year and a half, that the Western plan is to make a first-strike nuclear attack on Russia. That’s the only realistic strategy I can see succeeding if the goal is to deliver a humiliating military defeat to Russia.

But who knows, maybe the stooges in Washington, London and Brussels are so deluded that they are no longer able to reason or understand Russia’s historical fears of invasion from the West. Maybe they really are so stupid that they think they can defeat Russia in a conventional war without Russia resorting to nukes. Even if Russians loaded their hypersonic missiles with conventional warheads, think of the terror they could inflict on Western cities. Why is Russia being treated by the West as if it were a third-rate power akin to Saddam Hussein, Muammar Gaddafi or Hafez Assad?

Are Western leaders so deluded that they really believe they can defeat Russia and instigate a regime change without things going nuclear? Are they willing to sacrifice New York, L.A., San Francisco, Boston, Washington, Philadelphia and a few other U.S. cities by either provoking a nuclear first strike from Russia or launching a first strike of their own against Moscow? Perhaps they are so driven to depopulate the world and “save the planet” that they have become psychopaths?

U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken was asked Sunday which was the biggest threat to humanity, nuclear war or climate change? Blinken actually had trouble answering this simple question. He said they were of equal concern. Nuclear war is no more of a threat to Earth’s inhabitants than climate, Blinken said.

Is it any wonder we are spiraling toward World War III? The globalists who are running the show believe climate change is the most pressing threat to humanity, and it just so happens that their solution for stemming the “existential” threat of climate change is to drastically decrease the global population. To that end they have unleashed toxic death shots masquerading as “vaccines,” and now they are pushing for war with the world’s largest nuclear power. Their climate agenda also includes a war on farms and food-production.

Don’t forget the Deagle forecast.

To save the planet you starve the people, vax the people, kill the people with bombs and bullets. Is it all starting to make sense yet?

LeoHohmann.com is 100 percent reader funded and reader-supported. This allows me to serve up news and analysis that is 100 percent independent. If you’d like to support my work, you may send a donation of any size c/o Leo Hohmann, P.O. Box 291, Newnan, GA 30264, or via credit card below.

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118 thoughts on “Viktor Orbán speaks inconvenient truth: ‘Russia cannot be defeated because it is a nuclear power’”

  1. That’s fucking bullshit from a senile, stupid, Kremlin indoctrinated old fuckhead…RuZZia can be beaten…the US is also a nuclear power and was beaten in Vietnam

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    2. Geoff:

      If he is all of that, then how exactly would you define the “leader” of the free world? I’m willing to bet that at least the “Kremlin indoctrinated old f___khead” is cognizant of where he is located at the moment, how to get out of a room or in an out of his jacket.

      And about our vaunted superiority in nuclear arms, you may want to read a few articles by Dr. Peter Vincent Pry warning of our actual capabilities.

      Liked by 1 person

  2. His daughter – thats the situation

    and its mirrored over here in Europe
    Its the Antichrist WEF plan played out in front of us and I’m sure he integrated Chinas, Russias & the US role early
    Vlad took lessons in Davos in the early ’90s together with Macron Gates Merkel..

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    1. “Vlad took lessons in Davos in the early ’90s together with Macron Gates Merkel..”

      True! This cannot be forgotten or erased. Whatever front Putin displays, I believe that deep down he is a programmed ‘globalist’ pushing the WEF agenda.

      Liked by 1 person

      1. I believe Putin thought he could play ball with the Davos crowd early on but at some point he realized the deal he was offered would not be a good one for Russia. He committed the unforgivable sin as defined by the high priests of globalism. He put his country before his own self-interest. That doesn’t make him a Christian saint, so please don’t misunderstand me, but I don’t believe he’s all in on the WEF agenda. He still wants to sell his oil and gas at a price of his choosing and he still wants a strong Russia militarily and economically.

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      2. ” He put his country before his own self-interest.”

        Or is this a case of misdirection?

        Hello Leo, I would like to believe that Putin is a true patriot because I admire his political skills and his statesmanship. But the WEF has produced so many crooked politicians and it’s agenda is so world encompassing.

        I’ve said before that I believe the WEF is a club which you can never leave.
        I think for Putin it’s pay back time and his contribution to destabilising the world food supply is part of the deal.

        Liked by 2 people

      3. But you could make the argument that it was NATO that used Ukraine to push this whole war situation, which has been building since 2014 and which is now leading to the destabilized food chain. And Putin has shown way more patience and self-restraint than anyone gives him credit for. We just see it very differently so I guess we can agree to disagree on this one. You seem to be assigning god-like qualities to the WEF “club.” While very powerful, I don’t see them as quite to that level. Even the billionaires and rulers of nations and coalitions of nations have disagreements and part ways from time to time. The Bible even points this out. There is no evidence, even in the end times, that all nations will be in total agreement as one, monolithic and overarching entity. The closest to that will appear during the antichrist’s reign but we are not even there yet, so I see a lot of shifting and positioning of nations and alliances going on right now as the nations prepare for the vastly changing digital world order. Some are aligning with Russia, China and the BRICS, some with the US, UK and NATO, and we may even see some power shifts within those two coalitions before the dust settles. Could China, for instance, decide at some point to turn on Russia? I wouldn’t rule it out. It’s just too early to tell how this will shake out.

        Liked by 1 person

      4. “There is no evidence, even in the end times, that all nations will be in total agreement as one, monolithic and overarching entity.”

        Hello Leo, there will be wars and rumours of wars but there will come a time when Revelation will be fulfilled.

        Here’s a couple of verses from Revelation.

        7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

        8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

        But to focus on current events,

        I would say that it was Putin who ended the black sea agreement at a time that coincides with India’s cut back on rice exports.

        I’m analysing Putin’s behaviour in the light of the WEF agenda. The globalists are not gods but the speed and relentless media hype world wide during the Covid roll out shows that the WEF is an organisation that is controlling world affairs with very little opposition.

        That control will be increased even further when the world banking institutions roll out the digital currency etc.

        This is their time and by their own admission they are in a hurry to usher in the ‘global reset’. The arrogance of Klaus Schwab is based on a confidence that this is going to happen and such confidence comes from knowing that he has all the major players onside.

        This is my understanding.

        I’ve said before that the modes operandum of the WEF is order out of chaos. So, wars and rumours of wars is in their interest and I believe that the Ukraine war is the work of the WEF through Putin and Zelensky, both of whom have been schooled by the WEF.

        Of course there are many other players involved.

        Liked by 1 person

      6. @ Peter August 3, 2023 at 6:22 am

        Well spotted Peter.

        In the article it says:
        “The successful imposition of these new rules could instigate a troubling global trend of governments dismantling online privacy.”

        Putin is ahead of the posy. The ‘globalists’ often use a crises to bring in restrictive laws.

        Putin’s war has paved the way for expediency.

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      7. Please refrain from calling it “Putin’s war.” I allow a wide range of views on this site but that’s pushing me to the brink of a red line. That’s a phrase I see repeated over and over ad nauseam in the mainstream corporate media, so I sure don’t want to see it on my site. This war was started in 2014 by the U.S./NATO under the direction of neocons like Victoria Nuland. You could argue that Putin fell into their trap, but to call it “Putin’s war” as though it’s entirely of his making is hyperbolic at best, totally mind-controlled repetitive nonsense at worst.

        Liked by 1 person

      8. Peter – “Pootns new law criminalizes anonymity.”

        Anthony – “The ‘globalists’ often use a crises to bring in restrictive laws.”

        That’s their motto: “Never waste a good crisis.” It’s what despots like Putin and Xi and their counterparts Schwab, O’Biden and all the other Western tyrants do. Eventually, it’s how they’ll get desperate people to welcome a literally diabolical world leader who will promise to give them peace and restoration. Although the WEF New World Order and the Sino-Russia World Order are in opposite, competing camps, they both represent totalitarian regimes.

        But the thought briefly crossed my mind about whether Putin’s move criminalizing online anonymity could be signaling a new phase of preparation, like tightening security before ratcheting up the lethality of the warfare.

        Leo has thoroughly detailed in a number of his stories how and why the U.S./Britain/ NATO/Davos have been dangerously poking the bear for decades. I have no doubt that they have also done cold calculations about how many men, women, and children they could exterminate through some devastating war versus other methods like a jab in the arm to finally and quickly get the world’s population down to their desired goal. Igniting a proxy war against Russia through their maneuvers was the launch code to setting us on a trajectory that maybe only God Himself can stop at this point.

        Some of the readers of this website may be too young to remember or possibly weren’t even born when we were on the brink of such an unthinkable thing in the 1960s. I still recall the sound of the air raid sirens during that time as practice drills were held in our schools, my parents’ conversations, and talk around town about one of the prominent families, who could afford it, building a shelter in their home. There was a sense of uneasiness that was tangible even to children. I never thought that in my lifetime I would experience those feelings again like I have been since this war in Ukraine started.

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      9. @leohohmann August 3, 2023 at 2:05 pm

        “Please refrain from calling it “Putin’s war.” ”

        Hello Leo, your first sentence would have been enough.

        I was speaking in context. If I was talking about Zelenski in this context I would have said Zelenski’s war.

        I’m well aware of the dynamics which resulted in Putin declaring war on Ukraine.

        As I said earlier
        “Of course there are many other players involved.”

        I think you are overreacting when it’s not necessary.

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      10. Fine. I trust you meant it in a context with which I was not aware. I just saw that all-too-familiar phrase and overreacted. I see it literally every day in some or another mainstream report and it just makes me crazy because it’s such an obvious mind-control technique to repeat a phrase over and over like that. But apparently you meant it in another context. All is good Anthony.

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    2. Since the UN runs the politicians, the U.S. ordered to go meddle incase the war spread over into W. Europe, sending tanks, other war armaments and much of that was resold to other countries by the Ukraine leaders who profited

      Liked by 1 person

  3. RE: “The globalists who are running the show believe climate change is the most pressing threat to humanity,”
    Perhaps it should read, “The globalists who are running the show are telling us climate change is the most pressing threat to humanity,”
    What they believe may be altogether different.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. Yes the Deagle forecast IS the reason this admin is pushing for nuclear annihilation. They dont care they will be safe in their underground city
    along with the elites who have their safe places to go. And you can bet
    they are being paid big money to do this too.
    Dont for one minute think they dont know what they are doing!!
    Oh by the way I see the US is denying anyone with a Hungarian passport
    entrance into the US.

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  5. For reference…
    “According to the 2001 census, ethnic Ukrainians form 58% of the population of Luhansk Oblast and 56.9% of Donetsk Oblast. Ethnic Russians form the largest minority, accounting for 39% and 38.2% of the two oblasts respectively.” A recent poll found the people of those two states want to stay with Ukraine. Seems they know their Russian neighbors all too well. So the ethnic minority start a civil war, Putin brings in troops to bolster them and the rest of the world is to believe this mess is anyone’s fault other than his. Give me a break. Russian strategy, the best 16th century production money can buy.

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    1. Spoken like a truly indoctrinated Westerner, only able to see one side of the story. Easy to feel the way you and so many others do when your life experience can’t even relate to what it’s like to be invaded by a foreign army.

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      2. Yes, you apparently did. After the U.S.-instigated color revolution in 2014, the Ukrainian government started shelling Russian-speaking communities in eastern Ukraine. You probably missed that coup against a duly elected pro-Russian Ukrainian president as well. You likely also missed the peace accord that both Zelenskyy and Putin were ready to sign in April 2022, until the U.S. dispatched Boris Johnson to order Zelenskyy to refrain from signing. I could go on. But the long and short of it is that it sounds like you have a lot of catching up to do on the history of these two countries. History that you will never hear about from Western governments or their media lackeys. It all started in 1994 when James Baker IV promised Gorby that NATO would not expand “one inch eastward,” let along bump right up against Russia’s border in Ukraine, the Baltics, Finland and Sweden.

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    2. You obviously have not been paying attention . . . Did you miss the Obama CIA Coup in Ukraine in 2014? Didn’t notice the 46 Bio Labs run by the CIA?
      Or the massive Money Laundering Operation in Ukraine run by then VP Biden?
      While the Euro Loons are pushing the feckless NATO on Ukraine, after they agreed in the 90s not to . . .
      Ukraine has been pretty much decimated, but you and Lindsey Graham believe they are “Winning” . . .

      Meanwhile . . . China is eating our Lunch and you are looking in the wrong direction . . . great distraction as the Bidens’ take in another $40 Million . . .

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  6. I, personally don’t see an all out nuclear war happening. It is God who will destroy this world when Christ returns. (2nd Peter 3).

    Jesus says that during the great tribulation unbelievers will be carrying on as usual.

    “38For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark,

    39And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.” (Mat.24)

    This does not seem like a world that has been destroyed by nuclear war. But from what Christ goes on to say, it looks more like a ‘new age’ of demonic spirituality.
    Jesus says that during the great tribulation “there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.”

    So, what I see is a ‘new age’ / ‘global reset.’

    A time of relative peace for unbelievers but a time of great tribulation for God’s people.

    The wrath of God and the destruction of this world will happen after the ‘great tribulation’. Christ will return with his angels and rapture his church before he pours out his wrath on the unbelievers who remain on this earth.

    It is then, that this world will be destroyed and not before.
    So, we can expect to see continued conventional warfare and famines and pestilences, followed by a ‘new age’ when the man of sin will be revealed.

    “Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,”

    I believe that the man of sin will initiate the ‘new age’ and also the ‘great tribulation’ of the church.

    For Christians, this will be worse than a nuclear war scenario. So, it’s time to be preparing spiritually so that we can endure until Christ comes.

    Liked by 3 people

    1. You may be right, Anthony, but as I indicated in the article even an all out conventional war would be extremely devastating when you take into consideration the weaponry that’s now available, compared to the last world war.

      Liked by 1 person

      2. It should be obvious that Putin is NOT part of the WEF when the West ( and its WEF) openly states it wants Putin deposed and/or assassinated—doesn’t sound like he’s part of their club, does he?

        In addition, why would Russia invade Israel for natural gas??? Russia has the largest natural gas fields in the world. They were supplying Germany before we blew up the Nordstream pipeline so that we could sell natural gas to Europe at a much higher price. https://www.britannica.com/science/natural-gas/Middle-East

        Plus Russia has huge oil fields in the Caucasus that the German army tried to capture during WWII. They are a major oil exporter.

        All things the West covets. Sounds like you are very misinformed. Deal with facts, not false speculations.

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      3. Peter . . . Putin has spoken a number of times and he rejects the WEF Globalist nonsense . . . as he defends Russian Culture & the Orthodox Church.
        Russia & the USA are the only ones standing in the way of the WEF/CCP Globalist Regime.
        Europe is already done . . . & Biden’s Puppet Master is working hard to do the same to the USA.

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      4. Yes, Leo, I agree with this. Conventional war will be more controllable so that the globalists can achieve their agenda without polluting the world with radioactive fallout.

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      5. Unless the globalists lose their game really bad and get really desperate. Never underestimate desperation. We don’t know how nihilistic the globalists may get. Those depths have not yet been plumbed.

        Liked by 1 person

      7. @ kkayjae August 1, 2023 at 3:29 pm

        Hello Kayjae I believe that we are in the end times in which case this can only go one way i.e., the global reset in preparation for the man of sin to be revealed.

        The globalists will have their way because the man of sin must be revealed at the preordained time.
        The globalists are mere puppets doing what they are told in order to pave the way for the global reset.
        They will not get really desperate, they will simply follow instructions. Look at Biden vs Trump. Despite all the rhetoric and apparent hatred for each other they both sing from the same hymn sheet when it comes to the globalist agenda.

        I think it’s naïve to believe that Putin is a good guy.
        I believe that Satan has his stooges in place and I believe that Putin is one of them.

        As I’ve said before Trump and Putin have both played to the religious community and have reaped the rewards.

        The so called enmity between the major political leaders of the world, is just an act, in my opinion.

        Liked by 1 person

      8. I expect Putin will defend Russia to the hilt. That’s his job and he’s doing it rather well, and he has a lot of capable people around him. Certainly he does far better than how Biden defends the US from enemies foreign and domestic. Biden surrounds himself with criminals, deceivers, scheming warmongers, kleptocrats, perverts and degenerates, radical crazies. You can think Putin an evil man if you want, but what I see is that he is doing his JOB and Russia has progressed greatly because of that. So he has a certain degree of my admiration for that. And when he speaks, he doesn’t sound like a stupid idiot idly shooting off his mouth, or an hysteric or a raging bull like so many of our politicians and officials. Another plus.

        Think what you like about Putin’s “playing to the religious community”. His track record for what he accomplished for Russian Orthodoxy speaks for itself, and I don’t see the Patriarch or metropolitans or anyone fawning over him. As I said in another comment, it appears he is doing his Christian duty as a ruler in much the same mode as the Byzantine rulers, acting in “symphony” as it’s called. Another part of his job in that culture. No American president in recent times has actually supported Christian values in political situations, despite all their loud election campaigning about it. Trump came the closest, and that’s not saying a lot. And Putin has to stand for worship (not sit) like everyone else, just like the Czar once stood along with the peasant during Divine Liturgy. God be the judge of his heart; neither you nor I can do that and be just.

        If things keep heating up between the US and Russia, and especially if the US continues to lose most of the political, military and economic battles, I expect our leadership will get desperate and act even more irrationally than they do now. Every day there’s some new absurd policy coming down from on high, all of it more crazy all the time. It depends whether they think they are about to lose power, either in defeat against Russia/China, or in defeat against the American people who revile them.

        IMO, I don’t believe what’s going on in the world today is an act. It’s a lot of history playing itself out and the weight of history is a huge compelling force in itself. There may be a lot of puppets and puppet masters playing on the world’s stage, but these people are not gods, though they may “act” that way. They all make a lot of noise and trash everything, but in time they all exit life—most becoming mere footnotes in history if not entirely forgotten–their schemes and utopias that having arisen always fall, because there’s always the fatal flaw in every human plan for domination.

        In the end, God has the last word and controls the last Act. Maybe these are the End Times, maybe not. I’m not sure that it’s useful to constantly trying to figure that out. It seems it makes for a lot of anxiety, fatalism or fear-mongering in too many Christians, even non-Christians. All I can be sure of is that each of us are given today only to work in. What Jesus said about his work applies eschatalogically also to us: “I must work the works of him that sent me, while it is day: the night cometh, when no man can work” (John 9:4)

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      9. kkayjae August 1, 2023 at 7:13 pm
        “IMO, I don’t believe what’s going on in the world today is an act.”

        Hello Kayjae
        In fairness that’s not what I actually said. I said that The SO CALLED ENMITY between the major political leaders of the world is just an act, in my opinion.
        Here’s some of my opinions in response to your comment.
        History can be used as a tool to stir up deep seated insecurities and hatred.
        Putin used the history of the Nazi’s as a tool to stir up nationalism in Russia, in preparation for the war.
        He’s used religion to befriend the religious and to win over support among the ‘Christian’ right wing in America.
        And what do ya know! Trump is now playing the Nazi card by accusing his prosecutors of being Nazis. He’s seen this tactic work for Putin and so he has adopted it to hype his followers.

        Trump and Putin are two of a kind.

        What’s happening now in Ukraine was planned long ago and Putin has positioned himself in preparation for this. He is a top class politician and I believe the most experienced world leader. It saddens me that he is just a puppet but I must put bias to one side and see him for what I believe he really is .

        Putin’s accommodation of the church is for political expediency and has quieted church opposition to the war in Ukraine.

        To rule out eschatology when considering present world events is to obscure the full picture, in my opinion.
        I personally take comfort in the scriptures as I see events unfold.
        My hope and treasure is in heaven. I am not hyped like some Christians but I have a sober understanding that the world is coming to an end. I don’t believe it will end during my lifetime but I believe we are witnessing the beginning of the end.

        The western world which was once a bastion of Christianity is now resembling Sodom and Gomorrah. Such is the state of apostasy in the church and moral decline in western society in general.

        You might argue that Christianity is alive and well in Russia but how do you define Christianity.
        In my view the Roman Catholic church and it’s spin offs such as the Russian orthodox church are apostate churches and do not constitute true Christianity.
        What makes me think that all the political leaders are a team is their unanimity when it comes to the WEF agenda.
        The world wide roll out of the Covid vaccination programme and the combined responses to so called climate change.

        Russia joined the Paris climate change pact in 2019. It aims to cut its 2030 emissions to 70% of 1990 levels.

        So, there is a pattern of behaviour among world leaders. They criticize each other on the one hand but then on the other hand, they collude with each other in the roll out of the WEF agenda.

        So, these are just my opinions.

        Liked by 2 people

      10. Well stated Anthony. I don’t agree with everything you said, but it was well reasoned. One question for you: If Orthodoxy is a “spinoff” of the Roman Catholic Church, then would you agree or disagree that Protestantism is also a spinoff?

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      11. Anthony—I will say again, I do not believe that what’s going (whether YOU term it “so-called” or not) is just an act. You presented nothing to prove this is all an act. It’s just your speculation and second guessing. What good does that do? Best to deal with the situation as it presents itself and look for real facts of whatever is behind it to reveal itself fully. Otherwise, hyper-skepticism before more facts are in simply paralyzes action. If there’s an ultimate puppet master, it’s the devil. There’s certainly a gangster element at work in Davos, with the globalists, with my government and your government and they do deceive, especially financially, but mostly they state rather plainly their anti-human agendas. They aren’t hiding much anymore. No need to second guess. So we deal with what we see.

        Putin is not playing the “Nazi” card. He doesn’t need to. The Ukraine has had nazis for decades—Ukrainian Nazis were considered by the German Nazis to be the most vicious in Europe during WWII. A cursory look at WWII history will reveal this. There are still many Nazi supporters in Ukraine, descendants of the WWII Nazis and they don’t hide that fact. You’ve heard of the Azov brigade, yes?? That’s just one group of that ilk. Thoroughly Nazi and they wave German Nazis flags as well as updated runic versions of that. And they are running the show using as their cover a very compromised Jew, Zelensky. Unfortunately US/UK leadership is very fascist these days (a continuation of the fascism in the US/UK elites pre-WWII)—so a great fit with the Ukrainian Nazis as their proxy army to revive another assault against Russia. And it’s been NO secret that the US/NATO have stated for 30 years their desire to take apart Russia and rule it for themselves. Putin didn’t plan for 30 years to take apart Ukraine; it was us. So Putin doesn’t need to stir up “nationalist” feeling in Russia; most Russians know that the West has long been hostile to them in any case.

        It is almost amusing that you call the Russian Orthodox church a “spin-off” from the Roman Catholic church. Let me inform you about Church history—there were 5 patriarchates by the year 1000. Rome, Constantinople, Antioch, Alexandria, Jerusalem. These all represented ONE church,, teaching one theology and one communion, but each patriarchate was their own self-governing jurisdiction. The Church began in the East–in Jerusalem, Antioch. The eastern patriarchates were NOT under the Roman patriarchate, but under their own. So when the Great Schism came about in 1054, the division simply meant that the eastern patriarchates were no longer in communion with the Roman patriarchate because of their outstanding dispute, and that’s where it is today. No one “spun -off” from anyone of the original 5 patriarchates. The Moscow Patriarchate is actually a “spin-off” of Constantinople, as it was Constantinople that sent missionaries to Rus and formed the Russian Church, not Rome. Moscow was under the jurisdiction of Constantinople for 200 years before it was released to become its own patriarchate.

        Prove that Putin used the Russian Church to stir up war feelings.

        As far as Russia signing some WEF climate accord in 2019 to cut emissions—that was before the Ukraine war. Let’s see if they will hold to that now. Maybe not.

        If Trump calls the illegal political tactics of his opponents nazis, well, the description fits. I don’t care if you dislike Trump or not—the relentless persecution of him is a clearly illegal way of dealing with political opponents and one that has disastrous implications for our freedoms. Biden and his ilk are totally lawless in a very totalitarian way and champion many quaint Nazi ideals, like euthanasia, abortion, sale of human parts, etc. So the appellation of “nazi” to them fits.

        I don’t like discussing the Book of Revelation online because every Joe Blow has his opinion about what it means and 95% of it is pure speculation and often silly. I have heard and read all kind of nonsense using that book and other Biblical prophetic books. In the US, it seems that the Book of Revelation is often used by fundamentalist Protestant churches to convey neocon politics and propaganda; the Catholics have their Fatima prophesies about Russia that are fought over continually. A lot of nonsense in both cases. The upshot of it is that most Christians are kept in a constant state of dread over the End Times, instead of finding any comfort in prophetic literature. Otherwise I very much like reading prophetic literature such as Revelation, Daniel, etc and find comfort in it, too. And I particularly like scholarly studies of it. But as I said before, maybe these are the End Times, or maybe not. I don’t find it useful to figure that out the hour of the End, not even Jesus knew that. What I can be sure of is when I die that’s the end of the world for me. And that’s probably what will occur first, IMO.

        Like

      12. @leohohmann August 2, 2023 at 1:19 pm

        ” One question for you: If Orthodoxy is a “spinoff” of the Roman Catholic Church, then would you agree or disagree that Protestantism is also a spinoff?”

        Hello Leo

        Yes, Protestantism is a spin off from the Roman catholic church but it discarded much of the false doctrines and idolatry which defines the Roman catholic church. And it rejected the status of the pope etc.,

        But many of the protestant denominations today have become apostate and do not adhere to their original statement of faith.

        But as I’ve already stated in my previous comment the Christian church in the western hemisphere is in a state of apostasy…

        Another thing I forgot to mention is the world church which is being formed. This is another indication to me that we are in the last days.

        Liked by 3 people

      13. Orthodoxy also rejected the status of the pope. In fact, that was the main driver of the Great Schism of 1054. And, I would add, Protestantism might have discarded some false doctrines, only to turn around and add new false doctrines of their own. Hard to find a church on earth right now that hasn’t incorporated some false doctrines. But I believe there is a remnant that includes souls from many of the different sects within Catholicism, Protestantism and Orthodoxy, who still adhere to the basic teachings of Christ found in the Bible.

        Like

      14. Kayjae says.
        “Anthony—I will say again, I do not believe that what’s going (whether YOU term it “so-called” or not) is just an act”

        I say:
        I am not saying that what’s going on is just an act, so stop misquoting me.
        I’ve already clarified this but I will clarify again since you are not reading my comments properly.

        I said that The SO CALLED ENMITY between the major political leaders of the world is just an act, in my opinion. already clarified this

        What’s going on is very real and is changing the world irrevocably but the The SO CALLED ENMITY BETWEEN THE MAJOR POLITICAL LEADERS OF THE WORLD , is just an act, in my opinion.

        Kayjae says.

        “If Trump calls the illegal political tactics of his opponents nazis, well, the description fits. I don’t care if you dislike Trump or not—the relentless persecution of him is a clearly illegal way of dealing with political opponents and one that has disastrous implications for our freedoms. Biden and his ilk are totally lawless in a very totalitarian way and champion many quaint Nazi ideals, like euthanasia, abortion, sale of human parts, etc. So the appellation of “nazi” to them fits.”

        I say:
        You are missing the point .
        I’m not denying that Nazism exists.

        The point I am making is that Putin and Trump are using similar tactics to manipulate people.

        Kayjae says…
        “but mostly they state rather plainly their anti-human agendas. They aren’t hiding much anymore. No need to second guess. So we deal with what we see.”

        I say…
        Their anti human agenda has been couched in lies such as the Covid pandemic and their misrepresentation about climate change.

        They were not honest about the purpose of the injections or even the contents of those injections where the information sheets were purposely left blank.
        They are open about a global reset but they are not honest or open about the means which they are using to achieve their objectives.

        So, we help each other on this forum by discussing what we think is going on behind the scenes. We may not always get it right but speaking for myself, I am much more informed about the globalist agenda as a result of visiting this site thanks to Leo’s articles and the open discussion which follows.

        Kayjae says:
        “Prove that Putin used the Russian Church to stir up war feelings.”

        I say:
        I never said that Putin used the Russian Church to stir up war feelings. You are misquoting me yet again.
        I said “Putin’s accommodation of the church is for political expediency and has QUIETED church opposition to the war in Ukraine.”

        Spin off:-
        Ok, so spin off is not the best term to use. But the point I am making is that the Roman Catholic church and Orthodoxy once had unity with each other in the past,
        “Orthodoxy and the Latin Church (later called the Roman Catholic Church) separated from each other. ” in the 11th century..
        There are differences between them but there are also similarities in their doctrines which I believe are contrary to the the teachings of Christ and his apostles.
        The point I was making is that I see the Russian Orthodox church as an apostate church due to their religious practises which are in many case similar to the practises of the Roman Catholic church.

        Kayjae says…
        “I don’t like discussing the Book of Revelation online”

        I say
        I also am uncomfortable with this at times but this book is in the bible and many people are discussing what it is saying.

        There are too many people out there who are misusing Revelation to support their own false notions.

        If an interpretation of Revelation seems to contradict the clear teaching of Christ and his apostles then I feel it is my duty to challenge that interpretation using sound argument backed up by the gospels and the letters of the apostles.

        Kayjae says
        “I don’t find it useful to figure that out the hour of the End, not even Jesus knew that. What I can be sure of is when I die that’s the end of the world for me. And that’s probably what will occur first, IMO.

        I say:
        We don’t know the day or the hour, but Jesus clearly teaches that we should observe and be aware of events as they unfold so that we are not deceived.

        We are not meant to bury our heads in the sand.

        As for me, I will continue to watch events as they unfold to see if there is any correlation with the sequence of events as listed by Jesus Christ.

        Like

      15. Anthony–Forgive this long missive and this will be my last word in this discussion.

        You said: “I said that The SO CALLED ENMITY between the major political leaders of the world is just an act, in my opinion.”

        I said: “I do not believe that what’s going (whether you term it “so-called” or not) is just an act.” I will say more specifically (for I was thinking about global conflicts)—what enmity there is on the global stage is not an act. I think the enmity between East and West is real (and not so-called) as there’s been a long history of mistrust and aggression. It’s more likely that the conflicts between western globalists are an act.

        You said: “You are missing the point .I’m not denying that Nazism exists.
        The point I am making is that Putin and Trump are using similar tactics to manipulate people.”

        I got your point. I just don’t agree with it.

        I never said that you denied Nazism exists. I pointed out the Russia does actually feel threatened by an obvious Nazi presence in the Ukraine which the US unfortunately supports, (making us look like Nazis by association which does have some historical roots within our elites). Putin shares this view with other fellow Russians and speaks to that. Why would that be manipulating the Russian public to state what everyone can see for themselves?

        Trump’s calling the illegal prosecution tactic against him as Nazi is not mirroring Putin and “manipulating the masses”. “Nazi” is used as a common insult here in political conflicts. This is not to say that Trump isn’t manipulating the masses in other ways, but here he is merely hurling insults at his enemies.

        In reply to my “but mostly they state rather plainly their anti-human agendas. They aren’t hiding much anymore. No need to second guess. So we deal with what we see.” :

        You said: “Their anti human agenda has been couched in lies such as the Covid pandemic and their misrepresentation about climate change.”

        “They were not honest about the purpose of the injections or even the contents of those injections where the information sheets were purposely left blank.
        They are open about a global reset but they are not honest or open about the means which they are using to achieve their objectives.”

        I say: They are quite open about their reset GOALS and STRATEGIES per their anti-human agendas, to be more specific. I agree with you that some of their tactics remain deceptive (e.g. Covid jabs being probably the most egregious). However, regarding other tactics, their unwavering and aggressive support for depopulation through birth control, abortion, euthanasia, homosexuality have been very public for a long time, at least since the Planned Parenthood 1969 Jaffe memo (read online) and their propaganda and financial support is widely and openly spread on these issues. Climate change cults began with a vaguely anti-human philosophy back in the 70s that is today becoming more open about de-industrialization and the resultant depopulation as a solution. Either this movement was a part of the globalist agendas to begin with or it later merged with it. I’m not sure.

        You said: “I never said that Putin used the Russian Church to stir up war feelings. You are misquoting me yet again. I said–“Putin’s accommodation of the church is for political expediency and has QUIETED church opposition to the war in Ukraine.”

        I say: OK—I did misquote or rather misconstrued you here—my apologies. Really my remark was a conflation. For you had said that “ Putin used the history of the Nazi’s as a tool to stir up NATIONALISM in Russia, in preparation for the war. He’s used RELIGION to befriend the religious and to win over support among the ‘Christian’ right wing in America.” So understand this about Russian Orthodoxy, and then you might see why I made that remark. In 2005 Putin declared at speech during the reunification of the Russian Church and the Russian Church of the diaspora: “Orthodoxy is Russia and Russia is Orthodoxy”. He was absolutely correct about this. Historically, Orthodoxy gave Russia its identity and Russia’s soul is Orthodox. The connection between national identity and religion is very deep. So to me, to say that Putin is stirring up nationalism and befriending the religious—how can he not? However, Russian Orthodoxy, at its core, does not represent a finite, political national government (Russian Federation) but “Holy Rus” (a Christian ideal), as stated by one Russian Orthodox bishop of a western diocese. BTW, some of the Christian “right” cheer on the Christian values being reinstituted in Russia, but most Christians of the right don’t know what Orthodoxy is. Most think you mean Orthodox Jews.

        You often make the charge that Putin is using the Russian Church for political expediency. That’s possible, but I would have to see some real proof of manipulation or Soviet-style intimidation of the Church. And from the Russian sources, not what the western press thinks, which is conveys the neocon biases.

        You said: “The point I was making is that I see the Russian Orthodox church as an apostate church due to their religious practices which are in many case similar to the practices of the Roman Catholic church.”

        I say: That’s merely your opinion. Of course, I disagree with you. You haven’t studied Orthodoxy—you see some externals that look similar—but it doesn’t seem you really understand the basis for the practices of either Orthodoxy or Roman Catholicism. Furthermore, Catholicism and Protestantism are much more closely related theologically, culturally and philosophically than Orthodoxy is to any western church.

        You judge that Roman Catholicism and Orthodoxy are apostate churches? Do you merely mean the wheat and the tares that grow together? Or that the whole thing is rotten? Well, if both are apostate to you, that’s your opinion, too. And it also follows in that line of thinking that anyone who goes to such churches must be apostate, too. Which is probably why last year you pointedly challenged whether I was “Christian” or not. I resisted getting into a fruitless debate where we would be endlessly battling to convince each other. Not appropriate for this site and little would be accomplished. Suffice it to say, God knows what I am—and that’s the only one I will give account to.

        You said: “We don’t know the day or the hour, but Jesus clearly teaches that we should observe and be aware of events as they unfold so that we are not deceived.”

        “We are not meant to bury our heads in the sand.”

        I say: I agree, and I’m not here because I bury my head in the sand. Neither do I wish to find myself manipulated by personal or sensationalist interpretations of Biblical prophetic books. Every Bible free-lancer has his opinion about what these books mean, but none speak with any authority, and often with spotty knowledge of Scripture. But what I see is the depressing, anxious or fatalist effect the current popular obsession with these books have wrought on many Christians. Our approach to it all seems wrong.

        Furthermore, in the US, Dispensationalism has had a significant and deleterious effect on our foreign policy, due to its Christian Zionist roots. There are numerous scholarly articles about this strange influence on our State Dept and its foreign policy, so I’m not making it up. This pernicious influence has gotten us in trouble in the Middle East, and evil “Gog and Magog” (ignoring its original location) is projected upon Russia. Even China is supposed to be the armies of the East showing up at the battle of Armageddon. The neocons make hay with End times propaganda and too many Christians fall for it, and never question our military actions and financial warfare waged globally that have edged the West towards the abyss of collapse. This kind of stuff I see everywhere, even here.

        You said: “As for me, I will continue to watch events as they unfold to see if there is any correlation with the sequence of events as listed by Jesus Christ.”

        I say: Have at it. I watch too.

        Like

      16. Kayjae: “…in the US, Dispensationalism has had a significant and deleterious effect on our foreign policy, due to its Christian Zionist roots. There are numerous scholarly articles about this strange influence on our State Dept and its foreign policy, so I’m not making it up. This pernicious influence has gotten us in trouble in the Middle East…”

        Could you clarify what you mean by this? Specifically, which aspects of Dispensationalism, which administration’s state departments and how Christian Zionism has gotten us in trouble in the Middle East?

        The reason I’m asking is because the one and only Jewish state of Israel was re-born as a nation partially through the Zionist movement (but mostly through a prophesied move of God), and the U.S. State Dept has in certain administrations decidedly been anti-Israel/anti-Zionist.

        Also, could you point us to those scholarly articles?

        Please keep in mind that Dispensationalism” is a broad, blanket term because there are differentiations within, e.g., “ultra-“ or “hyper- dispensationalism. Some of these place pre-eminence on the writings of Paul (because he was the emissary to the Gentiles) to the exclusion of all of the rest of the Bible.

        Like

      17. Anna–Here is a link to a Ph.D thesis from SUNY that will explain the role dispensationalism has on US foreign policy. Just click on the paper and you can download the pdf.  Copy and paste this into your browser: soar.suny.edu/handle/20.500.12648/2637 I tried sending this with an active link, but WordPress won’t let me post it here.

        There are numerous articles and studies online on this subject. Google –dispensationalism American foreign policy–and you’ll see a bunch of stuff, both pro and con.

        Zionism is an “ism” –an ideology–covering a broad variety of issues. It has a race-based view with some proponents advocating racial purity, much like Nazism. Not all Jews approve of it because of this and some of the extremism in it, and not all think that modern Zionist state of Israel is the true Israel. Wikipedia has a good article on Zionism, which has some surprising allies.

        IMO Christians should steer clear of Zionism and not take sides in the Palestinian/Israeli conflict. That’s the danger of having an ideology like Dispensationalism inserting itself in US foreign policy. The ones who got hurt the worst in this conflict were Arab Christians, almost all of whom have been driven out of Palestine by both Zionists and muslims. American Christians, especially dispensationalists and Chistian Zionists, completely ignore this group and treat them like enemy muslims.

        It is true that some US presidents have been less than supportive towards Israel, but Israel has a very strong lobby in DC with Congress. So, overall, US policy supports Israel regardless of who’s president. At least, that’s how it’s been working out. This is balanced out with an equally powerful lobby from Saudi Arabia, but somehow this lobby almost seems to complement the Israeli one in achieving some cooperation on various issues in the Middle East.

        Neither the Roman Catholic Church nor Orthodoxy subscribe to dispensationalist theology. This is only a Protestant-based theology that seems to have most of its adherents in the US, probably due to the large majority of Protestants here. IMO, this forms the background to “Americanism”, a nationalist kind of Christianity, which is likely what’s projecting the idea of “American exceptionalism” globally (causing its own problems).

        Like

      18. Thanks, kkayjae for the link and this information. I’ll take a look and will get back to you – it may take awhile for me to read it because this is all new to me about the influence on foreign policy!

        Like

      19. Kkayjae, got a chance to read that dissertation by Nilay Saiya, Onward Christian Soldiers. It was very interesting as he made his case for the influence exerted by dispensationalist Christians upon George W. Bush’s foreign policy. I couldn’t help wondering, though, if this important voting bloc had been manipulated by some very skillful people in his circle (“Tell them you’re born again, and they’ll put you in office”). And as Saiya notes, “…his father appointed him a liaison to the conservative Christian community during the 1988 election.” That was a smart move by someone who has a Masonic temple on his Kennebunkport compound and who introduced “New World Order” into our vocabulary.

        To quote Saiya again, “He proved capable of not only winning the Christian Right vote in both the 2000 and 2004 general election – a crucial segment of the Republican base – but also persuading evangelicals and fundamentalists of the wisdom of the neoconservative agenda abroad after September 11 by deliberately invoking ‘double-coded’ language with overtly religious overtones.”

        But I still find it encouraging to hear that Christians had any influence upon Washington politicians back then, especially given the hell hole being created by the current occupant of the white house and the rottenness of the culture we’re all living in now.

        I hadn’t heard those negative things about Zionism that you mentioned and I believe that Christian Zionists blessing Israel with their financial, political, and prayerful support is a really, really good thing. At some point, all born again believers will be there with Jesus for 1,000 years (in our new bodies), as He rules the world from Jerusalem. I’m looking forward to that!

        So that’s it for my comments. Thanks again, Kkayjae for responding and for the information.

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      20. Kayjae, the following are just my thoughts on some of what “has gotten us in trouble in the Middle East.”

        I see some similarities between the antipathy of Washington toward Russia and its current leader, and its position toward Israel and the present prime minister, and that includes not only this current administration, but the one from 2009 to 2016. What is happening now with the proxy war against Russia and attempted removal of its leader has been going on with the state of Israel.

        Barak Obama’s dislike of Netanyahu is no secret. Not only did he treat the Prime Minister shamefully during a visit to the White House, but he had also tried to influence Israeli elections to prevent him from coming to power. Worse than that, however, was the Iran nuclear “deal,” which not only did not prevent Iranian scientists from enriching uranium to weapons level, but it lifted some sanctions against the country, resulting in almost $50 billion in usable liquid assets being freed up. On top of that, planeloads of cash were sent from the U.S. The first flight contained $400 million for a prisoner swap followed by two such shipments totaling $1.3 billion more. There is no doubt that a lot of that money has been covertly used to fund terror cells Hezbollah, Houthis, Hamas/Islamic Jihad, and Hashd Al Shaari in the ayatollahs’ proxy war against Israel.

        Biden tried to revive the Iran deal after Trump suspended it, and there has been recent talk about relaxing more sanctions to free up to $7 billion for another prisoner swap. He has also funded left-wing protesters in Israel who, under the banner of protesting Netanyahu’s judicial reform, are actually trying to topple the duly elected prime minister in what would essentially be a political coup.

        The Middle East has had its share of turmoil from the centuries-long conflict between Sunnis and Shiites, and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq certainly didn’t help the situation.

        But now Obama/Biden have thrown more fuel onto that fire by indirectly providing financial resources for terrorist activities in that region, pursuing a deal that hasn’t stopped Iran from continuing to enrich uranium very close to the requirements for one or more bombs, and facilitating socialist activists in Israel who are seeking to overthrow the government of the only democracy in the Middle East.

        Putin and Netanyahu are both strong nationalists, something which sticks in the craws of most of the Davos crowd. Similarly to what this administration is doing with its NATO partners against Russia, the U.S. is trying to remove the current leader of Israel, funding a proxy war against it, and in the process destabilizing the surrounding area.

        Liked by 1 person

      21. Anna—good comment! There have been and continue to be, no doubt, various factions within our government that seek control over our foreign policy and the rest of the world has to deal with our interior fights. Too often makes a mess and costs lives.

        Like

      22. Kayjae: “Anna—good comment! There have been and continue to be, no doubt, various factions within our government that seek control over our foreign policy and the rest of the world has to deal with our interior fights. Too often makes a mess and costs lives.”

        Thank you, Kayjae for all your good comments, too on this website! Even though you and I have not agreed on everything, I always learn a lot from your insights and impressive knowledge of history.

        Liked by 1 person

      23. @Kayjae

        Hello Kayjae

        You say:

        “You judge that Roman Catholicism and Orthodoxy are apostate churches? Do you merely mean the wheat and the tares that grow together? Or that the whole thing is rotten? Well, if both are apostate to you, that’s your opinion, too. And it also follows in that line of thinking that anyone who goes to such churches must be apostate, too.”

        I say:
        God knows the heart but as a Christian I can only know a Christian by his fruits i.e. his obedience and compliance with the expressed word of God.

        In the book of Acts we can see how this was first witnessed at the time of baptism when the convert would publicly call on the name of Jesus Christ showing Jesus Christ to be their God.
        The believer was immersed/baptised into the name of Jesus Christ.

        When I look at a churches which you mention where patrons pray to saints instead of only praying to Jesus Christ then I feel unable to call those patrons truly Christian. God knows the heart but based on the evidence presented to me I cannot say in my heart that a person who engages in such practises is a true Christian.

        However, these churches do recognise the deity of Christ and his death and resurrection in atonement for our sins. So, there is a foundation there on which a patron can come to know Christ should God choose to save that persons soul.

        But if a person persists in praying to the saints after being told that such practises are wrong, then on the evidence they present I would describe such persons as apostate.
        Because they are not recognising Jesus Christ as the only mediator between God and men. They would rather look to saints for intercession, instead.

        Here are some examples of calling on saints to intercede as practised in the Orthodox church.

        “O holy Saint Nicholas, wonderworker and healer, intercede for us before the throne of God, that He may grant us His great mercy and save our souls.
        O holy Great Martyr George, victorious over the dragon, pray to God for us sinners who have recourse to thee with faith, that He may deliver us from every evil.
        O holy Mother of God, Theotokos, ever-virgin Mary, accept our prayers and supplications, and bring them before thy Son and our God, that He may show His mercy upon us.”

        I would say to you that the only person who can bring your supplications to the Father is our high priest Jesus Christ. That is his office and it has been foreshadowed in the old testament where ONLY the high priest had access into the holy of holies. The high priest would offer a sacrifice before entering the holy of holies to represent God’s people in the presence of God.

        There were no windows in the holy of holies so nobody else had access to the presence of God.
        There was a veil through which the holy of holies could be accessed and we know that this pointed to the body of Jesus Christ through whom we now have access to the Father.
        We make our petitions to Jesus himself. No one can come to the Father except through Jesus Christ.
        Only Jesus Christ through the shedding of his own innocent blood has the right of access to the Father.

        No saint can take Christ’s place.

        “For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;” (1st Tim. 2:5)

        For me, the great fault of the RC church and the Orthodox church is that they obfuscate the mediatory office of Christ by introducing a litany of saints who they deem qualified to take that office. In so doing, they block that direct relationship with Jesus Christ and access through Him to God the Father.

        This is contrary to the teaching of the bible. They put obstacles between a person and Jesus Christ.

        BTW. I was reared as Roman Catholic in Ireland and have experienced praying to saints, first hand. So, I know what I am talking about.

        Liked by 1 person

      24. Anthony–I know you want religious debates over doctrine etc but this is NOT the place for it. I know all these same criticisms you make and used to spin them myself complete with the usual supporting Bible verses to pound people into submission with. And I was reared RC too, a 50s Latin Catholic, but if you had been catechized as I had been, you didn’t get much but the bare bones. If you came after Vatican II, you got even less. It was years before I made more of an effort to dig our the more serious writings on RC theology and praxis that I began to see another much deeper side that explained the reasoning behind many practices. So I came away with some respect for some aspects of it.

        I’m not RC now (because of the modernist corruption after Vatican II), but became Orthodox because it’s the deepest, most complete and most beautiful form of Christian prayer and worship there is on the planet. Not to mention its theology is sublime and symbolism very rich in meaning. Enough said.

        I understand you’re trying to be a pure and true Christian, but from reading some of your comments on the Bible, it seems to me that you are missing some deeper understanding of the very verses you use. But we could go round and round about this to nobody’s satisfaction. As I said, this is NOT the place to argue over religious belief.

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      25. @kkayjae August 4, 2023 at 12:01 pm
        Kayjae says:
        “it seems to me that you are missing some deeper understanding of the very verses you use.”

        I say:
        No I’m not !
        You asked a question and I gave you a comprehensive answer based on the scriptures.
        So, don’t be so condescending.

        Like

      26. Hello Anna
        Here are some of my views on Zionism and where I believe it is headed.
        I believe that Zionism is paving the way for the man of sin to reign from Jerusalem. Zionists are expecting Christ to reign from Jerusalem and are supporting the building of a temple believing that old testament practises will be resumed.

        But we are told in Hebrews that the true Zion is in heaven. There can be no true Zion on this earth. The notion of an earthly Zion on this earth is contrary to the scriptures.
        Dispensationalism facilitates Zionism because it denies that the man of sin will be revealed before the rapture. So, the dispensationalists will not see the man of sin for who he really is. .

        The state of Israel today is not an act of God, it is an act of the devil who used Rothchilde to help establish the current state of Israel.
        There will be huge celebrations when the man of sin is revealed. He will masquerade as God on earth and will reign from the holy place in Jerusalem and the Zionists will rejoice at his revealing. It will be a time of great delusion as stated by Christ in Mat 24 and by Paul in 2nd Thessalonians.

        Those who do not have a love for God’s truth will be deceived by the man of sin because God will send a spirit of delusion to punish them for their rejection of God’s truth, as stated by Paul in 2nd Thessalonians.

        Here is what the writer of Hebrews says about the true Zion.

        22But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

        23To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

        24And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

        25See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

        26Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

        27And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

        28Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

        Hello Anna. The true Zion is in heaven where it cannot be shaken by earthly events. Any notion of an earthly Zion is not in keeping with the scriptures.

        Liked by 1 person

      27. Hi Anthony, before I can answer your comments, are you referring to Christian Zionism? Wasn’t sure. Thanks!

        Like

      28. Anthony, this will be my one and only set of comments in response to yours, and I won’t be addressing all of your points, because I don’t want to distract from Leo’s story. There are two things, though, that I need to clarify in order to provide context for what I will say.

        First of all, I see Zionism as a really good thing and used by God to fulfill Bible prophecy. It spearheaded the movement of a people who had experienced severe persecution to finally have a country where they were free, could self govern and have all the rights and dignity as citizens that they had deserved but were denied in those nations they fled. As an American, their story really resonates with me. Only, instead of coming to the New World like the first colonists here, God’s people have been returning to their homeland that He deeded to them forever. He gave them this land as both a blessing and a safe haven that they could always return to after periods of exile.

        Genesis 13:14-15, 17
        And the LORD said to Abram, after Lot had separated from him: “Lift your eyes now and look from the place where you are—northward, southward, eastward, and westward; for all the land which you see I give to you and your descendants forever…Arise, walk in the land through its length and its width, for I give it to you.”

        A few more scriptural references to this forever title deed: Genesis 28:4, Exodus 33:1, Deuteronomy 2:12, Judges 6:9, Psalm 135:12, Jeremiah 32:22, Nehemiah 9:8, etc. I found 31 total but won’t list them all here.

        Second, concerning “Zion,” there are multiple meanings for that term. Here is a definition from Merriam-Webster: “the Jewish people: Israel…the Jewish homeland that is symbolic of Judaism or of Jewish national aspiration…the ideal nation or society envisaged by Judaism…Heaven…Utopia.” Wikipedia states that in the Bible, Zion refers to “the area of Davidic Jerusalem where the fortress stood as well as Synecdoche for the entire city of Jerusalem…the entire biblical Land of Israel…the “World to Come.”

        I had mentioned in a previous comment to you the difficulty in interpretation of scriptural passages, whether some should be taken literally or figuratively. From what I understand about your beliefs, you agree with me that the antichrist will be in literal, geopolitical Israel at some point during the tribulation, but you don’t believe, like I do, that the Millennial Kingdom will be headquartered there. Neither you nor I can change each other’s minds. Probably true for the rest of the readers here, so I won’t belabor this point.

        But I would like to finish by saying that it’s not Zionists who are responsible for the beast’s sojourn in that country. It’s true that the third temple will be built, but all of these prophesied events are proceeding exactly on God’s timetable and according to His divine will. They have to, and will happen. He has decreed it.

        Ok, that’s a wrap for me. Thanks again, Anthony, for responding and providing your insights.

        Like

      29. @Anna August 4, 2023 at 10:44 pm
        “Hi Anthony, before I can answer your comments, are you referring to Christian Zionism? Wasn’t sure. Thanks!”

        Hello Anna I’m referring to anybody who seeks to establish Zion on this earth.

        Like

      30. @Anna August 5, 2023 at 4:41 pm

        Hello Anna
        Let me say that I’m not against the Jews living in Israel. I lived and worked in Israel for almost a year.

        My comments about Zionism are in the context of the Zionists who are preparing for a Zion on this earth to be inhabited by Jesus Christ/ the Messiah. So, I wont get side-tracked into discussing other various definitions of Zionism.

        Christian Zionists including yourself are expecting Jesus to return to this earth and to live on this earth for a thousand years.
        I refer you to a previous comment you made, where you say:

        ” At some point, all born again believers will be there with Jesus for 1,000 years (in our new bodies), as He rules the world from Jerusalem. I’m looking forward to that!”

        I believe that there are errors in this supposition which I shall talk about later.

        My concern is that people are going to be fooled by the man of sin when he is revealed. I know that this is inevitable but it is my duty as a Christian to be a true witness for God’s truth. In fact I believe that this is the duty of every Christian. We need to stick to what the bible actually says so that we can expose the man of sin.

        The final apostasy and the revealing of the man of sin are big events in the eschatological calendar and must happen before the rapture. Many Christians refuse to recognise this because they have been fooled into dispensationalist thinking and have afforded the man of sin a cloak to conceal the timing of his coming.

        With regard to Zionism:

        So, there is a collusion between Christian and Jewish Zionists where Christian Zionists believe that by helping to support and fund the realisation of the Jewish Zionists plans, which include the building of the temple and the restoration of old testament rituals, that they are expediting the return of Jesus Christ.

        The rituals wont just be seasonal celebrations etc., There will be animal sacrifice including the ‘red heifer’ sacrifice for purification. So, this is a full on return to old testament practises including blood sacrifices, which they are planning.

        As I said earlier the return to such practises is to reject the eternal sacrifice of Jesus Christ on the cross. So, the Christians who endorse these practises are revolting against Jesus Christ.
        The Jews may be forgiven because blindness in part has happened to them until the fullness of the gentiles comes in.
        But Christians have no excuse.

        So, let’s look at your previous comment where you say:
        ” At some point, all born again believers will be there with Jesus for 1,000 years (in our new bodies), as He rules the world from Jerusalem. I’m looking forward to that!”

        The millennium reign of Christ is based on Revelation chapter 20, and it is stated specifically in verse 4. So, let’s have a look at what that verse actually says….

        4And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

        If you compare what Revelation 20:4 says to what you say, you will see that your notion is different to what this passage is actually saying.

        Firstly
        The only people said to be reigning with Christ for the millennium are those who were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;

        Secondly
        It says the SOULS of them….
        There is no mention of this group of martyrs having received their glorified bodies.

        Thirdly
        Jerusalem isn’t even mentioned in this passage. There is no mention in this passage of Jesus Christ returning to this earth.

        You may allude to old testament passages and say that they support your notion but you don’t know that. You are relying on the dispensationalist teaching which is full of holes and does not stand up to fair biblical scrutiny.

        So, in your notion you make some dangerous assumptions which are not stated in this passage. We must remember the warnings given in Revelation 22.

        Anna, you are an intelligent person and I believe that if you were to read the bible directly with your own mind, instead of reading through the contrivances of Darby and Scofield, that you could learn so much.

        I know you don’t want to speak anymore on this subject, so I will leave it at that and I wish you well in your studies.

        Like

      31. Hi Anthony, I thought we were done with this discussion, but since you brought up some more points, I would like to address just a few, then let’s both call it quits. We could always pick it up again in the future, when Leo posts another story.

        First of all, Christians, whether Zionists or not, can do nothing to influence the speed of fulfillment of prophetic events. We simply don’t have that kind of power. The unfolding of these last days is entirely within the purview of God. He is on the throne, not us.

        Not only that, it’s really calloused of any believers in Jesus to want to even try to hurry along the plans for rebuilding the temple or supplying red heifers, etc. because it will be horrific for Israel to have that monster there. I would say to any Christians who get elated about these plans, how would YOU like to have the antichrist living in YOUR neighborhood?

        Your concern about people being fooled by the man of sin when he’s revealed is valid because it says in the Bible that many will be deceived into taking his mark. But God will be sending His witnesses into this whole mess to counter the lies with truth: initially, the two prophets, then the 144,000 Jewish evangelists, followed by the angel preaching the Gospel. And the Holy Spirit will be present, working with them. God isn’t just going to abandon the world to the antichrist during this time, even though He will be judging it.

        The last thing I want to say, Anthony, is that you can’t divorce the Old Testament from the New Testament when it comes to prophecies concerning all the events surrounding the second coming of Christ and the Millennial Kingdom, because they span both Testaments. See Daniel 2:44-45 and 7:13-14 for a couple more, plus I would refer you back to Zechariah 14.

        No, Jerusalem is not mentioned in Revelation 20 but it is in Zecharaiah 14. Revelation 20 is also not the only reference to the saints who will reign, for that matter:

        Revelation 5:9-10
        For You were slain,
        And have redeemed us to God by Your blood
        Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation,
        And have made us kings and priests to our God;
        And we shall reign on the earth.”

        As far as Darby and Scofield go, I haven’t read anything by either of these people. I’ve heard that Darby was a Calvinist, and I always shy away from Calvinism as well as 5-point Calvinism.

        If there’s anything I didn’t answer, please make a note of it so we can get back to it in another story. Thanks again for a good discussion, Anthony.

        Like

      32. @ Anna August 6

        Hello Anna
        I thought that you had ended your contribution to this discussion. But since you have gone on to make more assumptions, then I am forced to offer clarification.

        You say:
        “First of all, Christians, whether Zionists or not, can do nothing to influence the speed of fulfillment of prophetic events. We simply don’t have that kind of power. The unfolding of these last days is entirely within the purview of God. He is on the throne, not us.”

        I say:
        I never said that we have the power to influence the speed of fulfilment of prophetic events. I simply said:
        “Christian Zionists BELIEVE that by helping to support and fund the realisation of the Jewish Zionists plans, which include the building of the temple and the restoration of old testament rituals, that they are expediting the return of Jesus Christ.”

        You say:
        But God will be sending His witnesses into this whole mess to counter the lies with truth: initially, the two prophets, then the 144,000 Jewish evangelists, followed by the angel preaching the Gospel. And the Holy Spirit will be present, working with them. God isn’t just going to abandon the world to the antichrist during this time, even though He will be judging it.

        I say:

        The 144,ooo virgins are not said to be evangelists. Revelation says no such thing. In Revelation 14, they are seen in heaven on Mount Zion where they accompany Christ wherever he goes.

        The angel you mention is not said to be preaching the message of salvation instead he is seen declaring that the hour of God’s judgement has come.

        The gospel is the sum of all it’s parts and is not limited to just the message of grace and salvation for believers.

        Jesus commissioned his disciples to preach the message of salvation and throughout the new testament it has always been the disciples who preached the message of salvation. Even with Cornelius The angel appeared to him and he was told to send for Peter who would declare a message to Cornelius by which he would be saved.

        The first angel in Revelation 14:6 is followed by two other angels
        The second angel declares the fall of Babylon.
        The third angel declares judgement on any man who worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

        This is followed later in Revelation 15 by the angels with the seven plagues
        And then in Revelation 16 the seven angels with the seven bowls of wrath.
        So, overall this will be a period of judgement.

        You say:
        “No, Jerusalem is not mentioned in Revelation 20 but it is in Zecharaiah 14. Revelation 20 is also not the only reference to the saints who will reign, for that matter: ”
        and you quote Revelation 5:9-10 to support your contention

        I say:
        But as I’ve already pointed out Zechariah 14 makes no mention of a millennial reign of Christ.

        Your reference to Revelation 5 does not support your view where you state that all born again believers will reign with Jesus for 1,000 years .

        Revelation 20 clearly states who will reign with Christ during the thousand year reign i.e., the martyrs as I’ve already pointed out.

        Revelation 5:9 doesn’t correlate with Revelation 20
        Revelation 5:9 doesn’t even mention the Millennium reign of Christ the group mentioned in Revelation 5:9 are not said to be the martyrs of Rev.20:4.

        You seem to be just parroting from dispensational commentaries where misinterpretations of the bible are rife. . I don’t see a thought process on your part and you don’t seem to be reading the bible properly.

        You may not have consciously read the original works of Darby and Scofield but you are influenced by those works which are the framework of dispensationalist thinking and commentaries.
        Your approach to eschatology is ‘a la carte’, using passages which do not correlate and don’t actually say what you are implying.

        I’m happy to end this conversation, if you are, provided you don’t come back with more controversial assumptions requiring clarification

        So, I’ll leave you to consider my reply and hope you find my comments helpful and that you will feel encouraged to start reading the bible with your own mind.

        I wish you well in your studies of the bible.

        Like

      33. Hi Anthony, Hopefully, Leo won’t mind if I respond to your comments further because I really would like to answer your questions! Thankfully, your comments and mine are pretty much at the bottom of the thread of everyone else’s in his story, so we’re not cluttering the conversation.

        In answering you, I think I should point out an important aspect of Bible interpretation, namely context – e.g., interpreting a verse, verses, chapter, or even book within the framework of the same, surrounding, or other verses, chapters and books in order to get a more accurate picture versus cherry picking a verse, verses or chapter and ascribing full meaning in that one instance alone.

        I’m going to break up my response into two sections. So here’s the first.

        A – “The 144,ooo virgins are not said to be evangelists. In Revelation 14, they are seen in heaven on Mount Zion where they accompany Christ wherever he goes.”

        Let’s examine these 144,000 in Revelation 14 within the context of Revelation 7, which describes where they are coming from:

        And I heard the number of those who were sealed. One hundred and forty-four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel were sealed: (verse 4)

        The text goes on to say, 12,000 from the tribe of Judah, Ruben, and so on until the last tribe of Benjamin is listed in verse 8. From that point on verses 9 through 17 describe a vast number of people who have become believers during the Tribulation:

        “…a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes…” (verse 9)

        “These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb…” (verse 14).

        Putting the pieces of chapters 7 and 14 together, I’ve heard the interpretation that these 144,000 do indeed evangelize the world, hence the “multitude which no one could number” in Chapter 7. Chapter 14, which describes the 144,000 being in Heaven signifies that after their ministry is finished, they most likely have been martyred as well. That would make a lot of sense, given that the antichrist will be severely persecuting those who don’t take his mark and, as you can imagine, especially those who are preaching the Gospel.

        A – “The angel you mention is not said to be preaching the message of salvation instead he is seen declaring that the hour of God’s judgement has come.”

        Looking at this through lens of context as well as precedent, the 144,000 who precede the angel have already laid the groundwork of the Gospel. God’s judgment is one aspect of the Good News. Man is sinful and deserves death, but He has provided a solution. Otherwise, the very seal, trumpet, and bowl judgments along with the angel’s words would be incomprehensible to the inhabitants of the earth. They would only see this all as senseless punishing by a wrathful God and not an exhortation to repent. So the angels’ words are a continuation of the Gospel. It makes sense, too, given God’s nature. He LOVES people and wants to give them every chance to be saved.

        This is the end of my first response. My next will address your other five comments.

        Like

      34. Anthony, here is part 2 and my last responses to your comments.

        A – “The gospel is the sum of all it’s parts and is not limited to just the message of grace and salvation for believers.”

        True. The entire Bible from Genesis to Revelation is the Gospel. Think of it as a beautiful diamond with countless facets. But I’ll name just a few of those facets. For instance, the justice, mercy and love of God. Because He is completely holy, sin demands judgment. But because He is also merciful and loving, He has provided a Savior. Another facet: His faithfulness. He will never leave us or forsake us.

        A – ‘Jesus commissioned his disciples to preach the message of salvation and throughout the new testament.”

        But aren’t we His disciples too – not just the twelve, Paul, and the first Christians of the New Testament, and therefore commanded to share the Gospel? We can’t pick and choose those scriptures that we either want or don’t want to apply to us. For instance, what about John 13:34-35. Isn’t that a command for all of us that we “love one another?”

        A – “But as I’ve already pointed out Zechariah 14 makes no mention of a millennial reign of Christ.”

        Actually, Zechariah 14 is all about the millennial reign, even though it doesn’t mention “1,000 years” anywhere in it. As I pointed out, all of the details about an event in the Bible are not always neatly presented together within one Testament, one book, or even one chapter. Nor are they always in chronological order. Not just events, though, but persons, too – specifically Jesus. All the details about Him – His purpose (sacrificial Lamb), background (root of Jesse, tribe of Judah), His nature (both God and man) and character (loving, merciful, holy, etc.), and so on are found throughout many books in both Testaments. Gathering all the scriptural details to get the overall picture is, for instance, like stringing pearls to get a necklace.

        A – “Your reference to Revelation 5 does not support your view where you state that all born again believers will reign with Jesus for 1,000 years. Revelation 20 clearly states who will reign with Christ.”

        To reiterate what I’ve been saying all along, the complete details about a prophesied event, person, or truth are not always neatly tied together in one nice package with a bow on it. I don’t know all aspects of who will be reigning with Him.

        Sometimes, verses will initiate more questions rather than providing all the answers. For instance, if the only people reigning with Jesus are those who’ve been beheaded in Revelation 20, then what about the Old Testament saints like Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all their descendants who placed their faith in God? What about the dead in Christ who are raised first in the Rapture? What about the disciples of Jesus, Paul, the early Christian church and then all the way to the present, including you or I, if we die without being beheaded before we are resurrected?

        So “saints” in Revelation 5 doesn’t give a lot of information. But neither does the description of those martyrs in Revelation 20.

        Finis!

        Like

      35. The following post, Anthony, is a spin-off of our discussion that I wanted to share because in the midst of political commentary on this website, people often refer to Bible prophecy.

        Probably more than any other type of scripture, prophecy requires A LOT of cross-referencing of other verses, simply because prophetic passages about events are often not all perfectly, neatly contained within one chapter or one book or even within one Testament. You need to be willing to exert that kind of energy because otherwise, the picture you get will be skewed.

        I’ve used the analogy before of “stringing pearls” to make a necklace. Or it could be likened to putting together all the pieces of a puzzle or the clues to a mystery. It takes patience and attention to detail and it’s truly rewarding when it all comes together.

        But sometimes it can be frustrating because not all the details needed to fully understand some prophecy are always provided. In this case, you might want to find a good, reliable reference source, yet even after that you might not get your questions answered.

        To illustrate this, I’d like to go back to our discussion about the Millennial Kingdom. Look at these scriptures as pieces in that puzzle: Zechariah 14, Luke 22:28-30, 2 Timothy 2:12, Revelation 5:10, and Revelation 20:2,4. These are just a few of the scriptures about His reign.

        Putting all these pieces together, we find that the Lord will reign from Jerusalem (Zechariah 14), the disciples of Jesus will be in His kingdom on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel (Luke 22:28-30), New Testament saints who endure will also reign with Him (2 Timothy 2:12), those who have been redeemed by Christ will reign as kings and priests on the earth (Revelation 5:10), during the 1,000 years Satan will be bound and those who were beheaded for their witness to Jesus will reign with Him (Revelation 20:2,4).

        Since Zechariah 14:5 says, “Thus the LORD my God will come, And all the saints with You,” that could include Old Testament saints as well, but it’s not specified. Ezekiel 37:12-14 is thought by some to be the resurrection of these OT saints, although it could be a prophesy about Aliyah after the Diaspora.

        I’ll respond to your latest comments in my next post.

        Like

      36. Hello Anna
        You say:

        Hello Anne
        You say:

        “I’ve heard the interpretation that these 144,000 do indeed evangelize the world,”

        I say:
        So, where have you heard this?
        This is conjecture and is not in the bible. And then you go on to build a case for your wild conjecture and the web you are caught in becomes even more tangled. That’s what dispensationalism does. You are adding to the book of Revelation, something which it simply has not said.

        You say:
        “Looking at this through lens of context as well as precedent, the 144,000 who precede the angel have already laid the groundwork of the Gospel”

        I say:
        This is a false context and you are using it develop a false narrative. Your argument is without substance and is built on fables.

        You say:
        “Otherwise, the very seal, trumpet, and bowl judgments along with the angel’s words would be incomprehensible to the inhabitants of the earth. They would only see this all as senseless punishing by a wrathful God and not an exhortation to repent.”

        I say:
        You are talking nonsense. If you read Revelation 6:16-17 , you will see that the inhabitants of the earth are well aware of what’s happening.
        Revelation 6:16-17
        16And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
        17For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
        The time of wrath has come and just as it was in the time of Noah there will be no mercy to those who are left on the earth.

        I suggest that you read all of Revelation 6 and you will see that there can be no doubt about what’s happening.

        God can be loving but can also be vengeful. He will punish a world which persecuted his saints and he will show no mercy.

        Anna, why are you deliberately altering what Revelation is saying.
        .

        The first angel in Revelation 14 is not said to be preaching the message of salvation instead he is seen declaring that the hour of God’s judgement has come.

        Paul speaks about this time when he says:

        “6Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;

        7And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

        8In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

        9Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

        10When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.”

        When Christ returns he will deliver / rapture his saints before pouring his wrath on the unbelievers who remain on this earth.

        There will be nobody saved after the rapture happens. Just as it was with Noah and likewise with Lot.

        You say “God LOVES people” but you seem to forget that God has other aspects to his nature.

        Nahum 1:2
        2God is jealous, and the LORD revengeth; the LORD revengeth, and is furious; the LORD will take vengeance on his adversaries, and he reserveth wrath for his enemies.

        So, you cannot use the ‘LOVE’ clause to deny the truth of what is clearly written. Sentimental nonsense is not helpful when studying the bible.

        It seems that you are happy to fool yourself by reinventing what the bible is saying in order to support your confused notions.

        Like

      37. Dearest Anthony, I don’t want to elevate your blood pressure any more than I have, so I’ll keep this short and sweet.

        Where have I heard about the 144,000 young Jewish men evangelizing during the Tribulation? Several places but I’ll list only two:

        Dr. David Jeremiah, “Who Are the 144,000 in the Book of Revelation?”

        Dr. David Reagan, “The Mysterious 144,000 – Who are the 144,000 in Revelation and what is their purpose?

        Dr. Reagan had a funny conversation about this with Zola Levitt, so I thought I’d quote it here. (A little humor might help lower your BP a bit.)

        I once called Zola Levitt and asked his opinion on this matter. Zola is a Messianic Jew who has a Bible prophecy ministry. When I asked if he believed that the 144,000 Jews of Revelation 7 would serve as evangelists trying to convert the world to Jesus, he said, “Of course!…God has given us that kind of personality so that we can be the world’s greatest salesmen. And one day, during the Tribulation, 144,000 believing Jews are going to use those skills to convert a great host of Gentiles to Jesus. We are going to push people up against the wall and hold them by the throat until they say, ‘Jesus!’ Before the Tribulation is over, we are going to convert more people to Jesus than you Gentiles have done in the past 2,000 years.”

        Like

      38. @Anna August 6, 2023 at 5:31 pm
        Hello Anna

        You say:

        “A – ‘Jesus commissioned his disciples to preach the message of salvation and throughout the new testament.”

        But aren’t we His disciples too – not just the twelve, Paul, and the first Christians of the New Testament, and therefore commanded to share the Gospel? We can’t pick and choose those scriptures that we either want or don’t want to apply to us. For instance, what about John 13:34-35. Isn’t that a command for all of us that we “love one another?” ”

        I say:
        Hello Anna, the point I was making is that it in the new testament, it is not in the remit of angels to preach the message of salvation. This is why the angel had to direct Cornelius to Peter. I was showing that the angel in Revelation was not preaching the message of salvation because the commission to preach the message of salvation was given to humans and not to angels.
        I have preached the message of salvation from the pulpit and on the street, so, of course I’m not limiting this great commission to just the apostles.

        You say:
        Actually, Zechariah 14 is all about the millennial reign, even though it doesn’t mention “1,000 years” anywhere in it.

        I say:
        You cannot say that! In doing so you are being arrogant and presumptuous.
        Even Paul with all of his learning and knowledge of the old testament did not properly understand the old testament prophecies causing him to persecute Christians. He thought he was obeying God, until Christ intervened and gave him understanding.

        You say:
        , then what about the Old Testament saints like Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all their descendants who placed their faith in God? What about the dead in Christ who are raised first in the Rapture? What about the disciples of Jesus, Paul, the early Christian church and then all the way to the present, including you or I, if we die without being beheaded before we are resurrected?

        I say:
        I believe that they and us will reign with Christ in heaven until God creates a new heaven and a new earth. In the gospel we see Moses and Elijah in active service as they minister to Jesus Christ. The resurrection of the dead is referring to their bodies which will be raised incorruptible..

        I’ve looked again at Revelation 20

        And your question has prompted me to see the possibility that those who were beheaded in verse 4 are part of the first resurrection in which case they will reign with Christ in heaven along with the rest of us. This would seem to correlate with the teaching of Christ and his apostles.

        But there is no mention of Christ returning to earth in Revelation 20

        Peter tells us what we should be looking forward to:

        “12Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

        13Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

        14Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.”

        You say:

        So “saints” in Revelation 5 doesn’t give a lot of information. But neither does the description of those martyrs in Revelation 20.

        I say:
        We cannot add to what has been said in Revelation. We cannot change what was said based on conjecture. To do so is a dangerous practise which can lead to heresy. Revelation contains a lot of symbolism and figurative language.

        We just have to accept that we do not fully understand all the prophecies in the bible.

        We can only build doctrine on what is clear. Which is why I say to people to abide by the clear teaching of Christ and his apostles as set out in the gospels and letters. Any other scriptures cannot be used to contradict this clear teaching
        Obscure bible passages and prophecies must be read in the light of the clear teaching of Christ and his apostles as set out in the gospels and letters.
        This is a safer way to study the bible.

        I believe debates like the one we’ve had are beneficial because we are caused to study the scriptures harder and to test what we believe.

        I hope I haven’t been too harsh when offering criticism on some of your comments. My intentions were to provoke you into questioning dispensationalism and it’s origins.

        Have a nice day. 😊

        Liked by 1 person

      39. “Revelation contains a lot of symbolism and figurative language.”

        “We just have to accept that we do not fully understand all the prophecies in the bible.”

        I agree with these statements and this is the reason I don’t dwell on these prophetic passages in my articles. They are simply too “debatable” and those who think they have them all figured out are likely going to be in for some big surprises if they live long enough.

        Liked by 1 person

      40. The fact that prophecy is almost one third of the Bible makes me believe that God wants us to know what He’s going to do, what things are going to happen, etc. Granted, these passages are the most difficult to understand. They can be taken literally or figuratively, and verses about one event can sometimes be distributed broadly, across chapters and books. It can be frustrating, too, when there are omissions – details that are simply left out. But He tells us to study to show ourselves approved, and I think He wants us to include even those hard to read parts like prophecy that a lot of people like to skip over. Good reference books can be helpful. I recently bought a couple: The Moody Handbook of Messianic Prophecy and Reading Moses Seeing Jesus. The fact that almost all prophecy surrounds Jesus is comforting to me. Especially now as the darkness is gathering.

        Liked by 1 person

      41. I agree that He wants us to understand it all but He also wants us to understand it in His timing and there is a great temptation by people who make their living selling prophecy books and doing speaking engagements to jump out ahead of God’s timing and ascribe certain events in the news to Bible prophecy. We are all guilty of it to one extent or another, myself included, but I try to look at overall longterm patterns and not a single event before coming to any conclusions on prophecy fulfillments.

        Like

      42. That is certainly wisdom, Leo. Just to echo again what I said, reading prophecy about our Lord especially gives me joy and hope, just like the four Gospels – something I really need these days!

        Liked by 1 person

      43. I also think it’s important to study all reputable interpretations of those difficult prophetic passages, not just one that you may be predisposed to appreciate more than the others for one reason or another. I have my favorites too, when it comes to Bible teachers, but I try to keep the others in the back of my mind just in case those favorites end up being wrong.

        Like

      45. Leo, true on the likely surprises people who live long enough on earth will see, hear of and experience. And even those who may be correct in their views or actual revelations of the scriptures. I firmly believe that we all need to hear the voice of God for ourselves, i.e. people who are seeking and serving the Lord. We can only receive salvation for ourselves. And I find it best to make sure the revelations we think we may have are coming from Jesus Christ the revelator. I take the wait and see attitude on prophecies and scriptures I may be unsure of, instead of settling for the only so-and-so is right, and everybody else is wrong about scriptural interpretations.

        Liked by 1 person

      46. Hello Anna
        Hard work involves thinking for yourself and not just blindly following a false narrative. you are either unable or unwilling to think ourside of dispensationalist commentaries.
        I’m thinking that these commentaries are using some kind of subliminal hypnosis.

        You say
        “those who have been redeemed by Christ will reign as kings and priests on the earth.”
        I say:
        So, is that referring to this current earth or the new earth which is mentioned in Revelation and also in 2nd Peter 3 where we are told to look forward to a new earth since this current earth will be destroyed.

        12Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

        13Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.”

        You say:

        To illustrate this, I’d like to go back to our discussion about the Millennial Kingdom. Look at these scriptures as pieces in that puzzle: Zechariah 14, Luke 22:28-30, 2 Timothy 2:12, Revelation 5:10, and Revelation 20:2,4. These are just a few of the scriptures about His reign.

        I say:
        None of these passages say that Christ will return to THIS earth and dwell here;
        Please stop wasting my time.

        Stop posting comments to me.

        Like

      48. @ leohohmann August 7, 2023 at 8:40 am

        Thanks Leo
        In future, I’m not going to get into long drawn out eschatological arguments on your forum.

        Like

      49. I actually enjoyed this one 😉. It showed me some things. Most of these debates go in a circular fashion and lead nowhere constructive but in this case you really shed some light on some questions I had, brother.

        Like

    2. I do agree Anthony that God has HIS own plan this world and the
      heavens we can see. And i agree the AC deceptions along with the
      false prophet will give a false peace to many, while we who KNOW
      the truth will be persecuted even onto death for Christs sake.

      But reading Revelation tells me that the ‘wrath of God is poured out
      on the AC and his followers beginning with the trumpets, esp. the
      5th trumpet, and the Bowl judgements, not after the great tribulation.

      After the great tribulation Christs returns to rule and reign for 1000 yrs
      on this earth, why would he destroy it? That will happen after the
      millennium and the White Throne judgement when 2 Pet 3:10-13
      agrees with Rev.20:11 and Rev 21:1, that the cleansing [with fire according
      to Peter’s revelation] ushers in a New heaven and New earth.

      Like

      1. Hello Marcus

        The trumpet punishments and the bowls of wrath don’t occur until AFTER Christ’s return.

        If you read Revelation 6 :12-17 you will see that when the sixth seal is opened Christ’s return is announced and in verse 17 you will see Christ’s day of wrath being announced.
        17For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

        So, the wrath of God is not poured out until Christ returns which will happen immediately after the great tribulation as stated by Christ in Mathew24:29 This is when Christ will rapture his church before his wrath is poured out on the unbelievers who remain on this earth as stated by Christ in Mat. 29-31.

        Just as Noah was rescued on the very same day that God poured out his wrath and likewise with Lot, so it will be that the church will be rescued on the very same day that Gods wrath is poured out on this world when Christ returns. We are not appointed to wrath.

        31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

        So, when the sixth seal opened we see the return of Christ and the coming of his day of wrath.
        But the seven trumpets have not been blown yet.

        The seven trumpets do not happen until the seventh seal is opened.
        And the vials of wrath do not happen until Revelation 16.

        Here is the opening of the sixth seal.
        You can see the beginning of the destruction of this present creation.

        12And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

        13And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

        14And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.

        15And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;

        16And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

        17For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

        This is the day of the Lord which Peter refers to in 2nd Peter3.

        I will respond to your thoughts on the millennium in a separate comment.

        I hope you find this comment helpful.

        Like

      2. Hello Marcus
        The day of the Lord and the day of wrath are one as shown in Revelation 6.

        In 2nd Peter 3, Peter is referring to the second coming of Jesus Christ.

        He is referring to the scoffers who disbelieve the second coming of Christ.
        This scoffing can hardly be after the glorious return of Christ has happened and his wrath poured out on the unbelievers who inhabit this earth.

        Here’s what Peter says..

        3Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

        4And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

        These scoffers are scoffing because they say “all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.”

        So, the second coming of Christ obviously hasn’t happened yet. Peter is obviously referring to the second coming of Christ which has yet to happen.

        With regard to the millennium there is much conjecture and confusion.
        All I can say is that nowhere in Revelation do I see Christ setting foot on this earth again. From the time of the rapture, onward, this earth will suffer destruction as his wrath is poured out on it.

        There is a lot of speculation and conjecture about The millennium mentioned in Revelation.

        All I can say is that we cannot use an obscure passage to contradict the clear teaching of Christ and his apostles.

        I personally believe that Jesus Christ will not set foot on this earth again nor will his resurrected saints, in my opinion.

        I believe that Christ will reign with his glorified saints in a new heaven and a new earth suited for the glorified Christ and his glorified saints.

        Paul says that we will changed and given immortal bodies which are suited for heaven.

        There is no mention in the gospels and the letters of Christ dwelling on this earth with his resurrected saints.

        We can only understand what has been explained. We cannot build sound doctrine on anything that has not been explained by Christ and his apostles in the gospels and letters of the apostles.

        So, these are just my opinions based on my understanding of the scriptures.

        Like

      3. Marcus – “After the great tribulation Christs returns to rule and reign for 1000 yrs on this earth, why would he destroy it? That will happen after the millennium and the White Throne judgement when 2 Pet 3:10-13 agrees with Rev.20:11 and Rev 21:1, that the cleansing [with fire according to Peter’s revelation] ushers in a New heaven and New earth.”

        I agree with everything you’re saying, Marcus. Yeshua will be reigning on earth from Jerusalem (not from NYC, London, Paris, Rome, etc.) for 1,000 years, followed by these other prophesied events. Also, the New Jerusalem will descend upon the new earth from Heaven (Revelation 21).

        Zechariah 14 is a beautiful description of His return, defeat of His enemies, and the restoration of Israel.

        Like

      4. Interesting. If the New Jerusalem descends from heaven, then perhaps there is a new earth, too, for this 1,000 year reign? If that’s the case maybe mankind will destroy the earth , or large parts of it, through nuclear, chemical and biological warfare? I’m just speculating. I do not have a dog in this race regarding end-times events. My priority is just to take one day at a time and keep the faith.

        Like

      5. Leo – “If the New Jerusalem descends from heaven, then perhaps there is a new earth, too, for this 1,000 year reign? If that’s the case maybe mankind will destroy the earth , or large parts of it, through nuclear, chemical and biological warfare?”

        I believe the 1,000 years will take place on the current earth, after the Tribulation ends. Much of it will have been ravaged by both the antichrist and from the judgments of God (seals, trumpets, and bowls). There will likely be some horrific warfare during (and possibly also before) those seven years. I haven’t found any prophecies in the Bible about World Wars I or II, so we could have a devastating nuclear, chemical, or biological exchange with Russia (and other countries) that isn’t predicted in there either.

        The new heavens and new earth are created after the total destruction of the former by God, after the 1000-year rule of His Son from Jerusalem has ended and the great white throne judgment has taken place (as Marcus pointed out). The New Jerusalem doesn’t descend until there is a new earth.

        It sounds like there will be major restorative work to do then, for the Messiah and His Church when He sets up His Millennial reign. Although, since He will destroy the beast instantly (2 Thessalonians 2:8) upon His return, He could also repair all the damage spontaneously.

        Liked by 1 person

      6. @Anna August 1, 2023 at 5:01 pm

        Hello Anna your remarks on Zechariah are in keeping with the dispensationalist theology. They have hijacked this passage and have used it to support their false notions which contradict the clear teaching of Christ and his apostles.

        Please tell me, where does Zechariah mention a millennium?

        When I read Zechariah 14 with my own eyes I see that it ends with the following verses.

        “20In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD’S house shall be like the bowls before the altar.

        21Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts.”

        The notion of an alter and offering sacrifices in the temple is and old testament practise and no longer has a function since Christ offered up the perfect sacrifice on the cross whose efficacy is eternal.

        To suggest that old testament sacrifices will resume in the future is to deny the eternal efficacy of the sacrifice of Jesus Christ.
        The temple curtain was torn in two when Christ offered the perfect sacrifice acceptable to the father and the temple itself was subsequently destroyed.
        So, I do not see a resumption of temple sacrifices happening after Christ’s return.

        Old testament prophecies use a lot of figurative language which cannot be explained by academic study. They can only be explained when God gives the interpretation.

        For example Isaiah 40:3-5
        “3The voice of him that crieth in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway for our God.

        4Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain:

        5And the glory of the LORD shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together: for the mouth of the LORD hath spoken it.”

        This passage in Isaiah’s prophecy would seem to be describing seismic and heavenly events but when we read Luke’s gospel, we see that this passage is actually speaking about John the Baptist heralding the revealing of Jesus Christ.

        So, as I’ve said before. We cannot use obscure biblical passages to contradict the clear teaching of Christ and his apostles as set out in the gospels and the letters of the apostles.

        The dispensationalists look for any passage they can use to support their false notions. They bear a false testimony and have more faith in the heretic and convicted fraudster namely Cyrus Scofield than they have in the clear teachings of Christ and his apostles.

        So, you must choose who you believe in, Scofield or Jesus Christ.

        I rest my case.

        Like

      7. Thank you, Anthony, for taking the time to respond to my comments. I’ll just share the following responses to some of what you said and will then rest my case as well, so we won’t be deflecting from the lede of Leo’s story.

        “Please tell me, where does Zechariah mention a millennium?”

        Correct. Zechariah doesn’t mention that here, so this chapter does not give a complete picture of the millennial kingdom when Yeshua rules from Yerushalayim (Jerusalem) and Satan is bound for that entire period. But other scriptures do refer to the thousand years, for instance, Revelation 20:2-7.

        “The notion of an alter and offering sacrifices in the temple is and old testament practise and no longer has a function since Christ offered up the perfect sacrifice on the cross whose efficacy is eternal…”

        That’s absolutely true that Yeshua Moschiach (Messiah) is the perfect, sacrificial Lamb of God who paid the price for the sin debt of all of us. That is forever settled in Heaven and on earth. But not every sacrifice was offered for the propitiation of sin. The three voluntary sacrifices – burnt, grain, and peace offerings – all served different purposes. For instance, the grain offering of the first fruits was to express gratitude to God for His provision. So any sacrifices in the 1,000 years would not be to try to absolve sin. As born-again believers we will always be sinning as long as we’re in this temple of flesh, but He has made provision for that: James 5:16, 1 John 1:9, 1 John 2:1-2.

        “Isaiah 40:3-5…Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low: and the crooked shall be made straight, and the rough places plain:…This passage in Isaiah’s prophecy would seem to be describing seismic and heavenly events but when we read Luke’s gospel, we see that this passage is actually speaking about John the Baptist heralding the revealing of Jesus Christ.”

        It is true that some passages are figurative, others literal. In the case of these verses from Isaiah, they can certainly not to be taken literally; no actual earthquake or seismic event could ever make cosmetic changes to a landscape (“crooked shall be made straight”).

        Anthony, you’ve rightly pointed out the difficulty in interpreting Bible prophecy. It certainly is challenging. For instance, just as all the prophecies surrounding Yeshua’s first coming are found in different books throughout the Tanakh (Old Covenant), so all the prophecies about His second coming are found in different books in both the Tanakh and B’rit Hadasha (New Covenant). Also, prophesied events are not always neatly grouped together in chronological order within the same book or sometimes even within a chapter of that book. For that matter, the books of both the Old and New Covenants are not necessarily grouped in the Bible according to the historical dates in which they were written.

        Having said all this, I now rest my case. Thanks, again, Anthony for responding. I always welcome your insights and challenges to any of my comments. And thank you, Leo, for allowing us to sometimes divert from the topic to debate theological topics. God bless you both!

        Liked by 1 person

      8. @Anna August 2, 2023 at 3:39 pm

        Thanks Anna for your courteous reply.

        And thanks Leo for allowing intelligent debate on your site.

        Like

    3. As in my dream in December 1986, 8 months after Chernobyl Nuclear Plant “accident,” (and not a Christian at that time, but it caused me to get out of the New Age and accept Jesus) WHEN THE NUKES COME DOWN, WE GO UP.

      Like

      1. @Shoshonnah August 2, 2023 at 9:45 am

        Hello Shoshonnah

        I glad that you got out of the ‘new age’ . I mention the ‘new age’ quite often in my comments because I believe that ‘new agers’ will embrace the man of sin when he is revealed.

        Like

    4. kkayjaesays:
      ” it seems to me that you are missing some deeper understanding of the very verses you use. But we could go round and round about this to nobody’s satisfaction. As I said, this is NOT the place to argue over religious belief.”

      I say:
      I am not missing some deeper understanding of the very verses I use.

      You asked a question and I gave you a comprehensive answer based on the scriptures.
      But I’ve noticed with you that when you are confronted with the truth, you become evasive and condescending.
      So, I wont waste any more time with you. I leave you to God.

      Like

      1. Please, yes, let’s leave each other to God on these debates over theology. If this was a theology site, I would probably have a much more narrow audience where we all agreed on one particular interpretation of scriptures. But it’s not so let’s keep it friendly and respectful when discussing such issues, giving each other a long leash of grace while knowing we are on a site that has Catholics, Orthodox and probably multiple strains of Protestantism. If even the Protestants don’t agree on certain interpretations of theological matters, certainly we can’t expect Catholics and Orthodox to agree with each other and also the Protestants. That just sets us up for diversions and utter failure. I write about issues that affect us in the here and now and from time to time weigh in with my biblical perspective but try to not ram any particular eschatological view down people’s throats. Thanks for trying to do the same. God bless.

        Liked by 3 people

  7. I’m sure the US political leadership would love for Russia or China to nuke or invade the US. The massive suffering and destruction would be the perfect distraction from all of their crimes under the sun. Including the increasing deaths and diseases from all vaccines and the toxic pharmaceutical products. Furthermore, I doubt that any nation on earth whose leadership have funded and participated in all manner will be standing tall by the end of the great tribulation.

    Like

    1. Anne – “Furthermore, I doubt that any nation on earth whose leadership have funded and participated in all manner will be standing tall by the end of the great tribulation.”

      Amen, Anne!

      As we’re all writing our comments here about the evil deeds of these people, imagine how much more God is recording everything that they do and will judge them by those acts:

      “And I saw the dead, small and great, standing before God, and books were opened.”

      Like

  8. Well the horsemen are ready to ride. It’s all about to hit the fan. The end of days is here. There’s nothing that can be done to stop it, it’s Bible prophecy. All the puzzle pieces are in place. God is on His throne. The show will go on as ordained. I am not going to fear anything. When it’s my time to die I will gladly lay my life down for the Lord. For the time being over here in my neck of the woods I am going to savor the rest of the summer. It may be the last one that we can truly enjoy in any sense of the word. As summer sets and slowly fades into autumn, who knows what the winds of change will bring. I recall reading in those history books about the Holocaust that many pogroms were rolled out on September 1st. Their lives were never the same again. Either way we see the darkness closing in, slower at times and at other times faster. There are times in my life when I am out taking a walk in nature and it is so quiet and peaceful that you wouldn’t know there is a hint of trouble anywhere, let alone the apocalypse around the corner. You almost forget about it until you come home and hop on the internet again and enter into the front lines and trenches of that intense world. Both are reality, just polar opposites. I can stroll along the street fair and buy a lemonade and sit and rest and watch the people going by, pushing strollers, carrying bags of produce, many totally oblivious to the fact that life is about to be changed forever and in a big way. Just like no one ever sees these things coming. We don’t know the exact moment, but we know it is coming. We can feel it in the air. Just like when autumn creeps in. You feel it in small, slow, subtle ways. You start to reach for that cover that’s just a little thicker in the middle of the night, you feel a damp chill early in the morning and late at night. The sun starts to go down just a little bit earlier and the shadows are just a wee bit longer, unnoticed by most. But for those of us who are well seasoned, we have a trained sense for these things, these subtle changes that are missed by most. At almost 51 now I notice these little changes in many ways, from the seasons of nature to the season that we are living in.

    Enjoy this time and savor it. We will never get it back.
    Blessings!

    Liked by 3 people

    1. Seems to me the horsemen of the apocalypse are already riding. If I remember correctly, every disaster mentioned during their release is already happening. Maybe not at the accelerated level of judgment mentioned in the Book Of Revelation. Nevertheless, the plagues and the judgments are have already started to some degree. The birth pangs have definitely begun. I am sure they will accelerate towards the end of time as we know it.

      Liked by 2 people

      1. The only thing that seems to refute this ,sister Anne,
        that Dan 9:27a says that “he” [apparently the AC person]
        will confirm a covenant with many including Israel and
        the then the time of tribulation and trouble begins.
        I dont think that has happened yet, do you?
        As the Lord said in Mt 24 we are in a time of birth pains
        you are correct…..but the seals are not broken until the
        1st rider rides and confirms that covenant or treaty. At
        least that is my interpretation?

        Like

      2. The U.S. is negotiating a peace treaty right now between Israel and Saudi Arabia. Trump negotiated one between Israel and I believe it was the United Arab Emirates and back in the 1970s Carter negotiated one between Israel and Egypt. How do we know some or all of these aren’t the the covenant with many? I’m not saying it is, but all I’m saying is how do we know it’s not? We as American Christians tend to have these prophecies built up in our heads as to the way we think they will go down based on this or that preacher we may have listened to but I am of the opinion that most of the preachers don’t have a clue what they’re talking about when it comes to most of these prophetic books in the Bible. I know I don’t. After listening to all of them it sounds like they all are able to make strong arguments because that was what they were trained to do in seminary, but how many are actually hearing from the Spirit of God and are able to rightly divide the Word of God, versus just parroting what some other preacher or seminary professor taught them?

        Liked by 2 people

      3. Good points Anthony. And who can affirm or deny that the son of perdition isn’t alive and already at work in the world? One thing I’m certain of on this end. If it becomes mandatory to have something installed in or on my body to conduct financial transactions. If that’s not the mark of the beast, I don’t know what is. No doubt on this end that that’s what the digital currency craze plans and talks are all about.

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      4. Here are a few things that we are constantly hearing about that should raise red flags for every Christian whether or not they think they have everything all figured out: Being denied goods, services or opportunities based on our social credit scores, and not being allowed to participate in any type of financial transactions outside of the use of central bank digital currencies. And there is no doubt on this end that the days are coming that anyone who refuses to get an implant or an injection that includes their health and financial records among other things will be unable to buy or sell anything. I’m not exactly sure when that day will come. But everyone looking can see that the mark of the beast financial system is already being planned and constantly talked about being implemented. So if I’m alive on earth when this system goes live. That will be the moment that I’ll have to decide what is more important to me. The redemption of my soul or the temporal things of the earth, which will burn up with the earth.

        Liked by 1 person

    2. “Enjoy this time and savor it. We will never get it back.”

      Hello Iblandina
      I have been thinking along these lines too.

      The thought that things are going to change for the worst brings a deeper appreciation for what we have today.

      Liked by 3 people

  9. Western governments have become a nightmare of insanity and criminality. There is NO way Russia will allow itself (nor should it) to be destroyed by anyone.

    I hope the American people are waking up to the fact that the filthy neocons that have a strangle-hold on our government are acting out the old Nazi rapaciousness towards Russia. These neocons pushed Ukrainian Nazis –very real and very nasty Nazis–to do our dirty work in provoking Russia. When Russia struck back against this existential threat, our neocons then failed to supply Ukraine for a major WWI/WWII warfare. It gave them an odd assortment of mismatched military equipment, even scrounging for old Soviet era tanks in Peru to give to Ukraine. How ridiculous is that?? How could the Pentagon expect anyone to mount an effective military action against their designated “enemy– a 1st nation peer military– without air power, without adequate artillery or munitions, but sabotages every effort for peace negotiation and still insist that Ukraine bleed itself white in useless and very bloody “counteroffensives”. HOW’S THAT FOR A SETUP? Didn’t anyone in the Ukraine ever study US war history since WWII, before committing themselves to an alliance with NATO/US?? Didn’t they know their men, used in a US proxy war, would be needlessly sacrificed and then the whole country dumped like smelly garbage, as we have done every single time?? Or did our filthy neocons dump boatloads of money on these proxy army leaders to bribe them to betray and abuse their countrymen the way they do?? Corruption everywhere. It’s disgusting.

    At my parish church, one of our Ukrainian mothers recently got news that her son, Olek, was killed in this war, probably during the recent “counteroffensive”. That’s the second family in our parish affected by a Ukrainian war death. Yesterday, being 40 days since his death, this mother treated the parish with a memorial dinner in his honor, a custom in Orthodoxy. I’ve seen picture of this young man—he was married with a family, probably in his late 20s. The mother arranged photos of him from his infancy to recent days, together with a memorial message she wrote to him. I wish I knew what to say to her. I see her in church every Sunday and wonder how she can bear up. For I feel ashamed because my country directly set this young man up for death, too.

    Biden, his whole family, and many other corrupt politicos, slavering for blood, have profited from the civil war in Ukraine and now this war, which they use as a money laundering machine. Even the Ukrainian leadership has been selling our weapons to the highest bidder, so that now (as Col Douglas MacGregor said in one of his recent interviews) these weapons, like Javelin missiles, are in the hands of Mexican drug cartels invading or border. HOW’S THAT FOR A SETUP?? The media which covers up or excuses their evil deeds also have blood on their hands. God bring them to judgment before it’s too late for everyone on the planet!

    Liked by 3 people

      1. Tom–

        In case you didn’t know–

        All this began because NATO/US caused an 8 year civil war in Ukraine which attacked the Russian speaking eastern half, and NATO was determined to make Ukraine a member—which violated a 30 year old agreement between NATO and Russia not to expand NATO to Russian borders. To expand NATO to include Ukraine (which was historically the invasion route for Western armies) was the red line that Russia warned them NOT to cross but we wouldn’t listen. And we continue to sabotage all peace negotiations between them. The history is there for all to see. Read it.

        This war is our damn fault—in case you didn’t know.

        Liked by 2 people

      2. After Obama’s 2014 Coup in Ukraine . . . and the CIA established 46 Bio Labs some on the Border with Russia.
        Should Russia have acted like Joe Biden & the Mexican/CCP Drug Cartels and just let them do their thing? Now operating in 100s of US Cities . . .

        Only ONE of the Last 4 Presidents didn’t have an invasion . . . got impeached for asking the clown Zelensky about the Money Laundering Operation in Ukraine which benefitted the Bidens, Klintons & Obamas.

        Liked by 1 person

      3. Because the US provoked them into it…what don’t you see about this? The Americans (Biden, Obama, Clintons, probably Bushes, Lindsey Graham, Kerry et al) doing the bidding of the WEF have been pushing this thing along for years…years. Zelenskyy (the actor) is on the American’s payroll! He works for the WEF also, he hasn’t seen a day’s work on the battle field and never will. There is not to be an end to this until the world’s food and energy supply is depleted to the point that the American people give up, lose hope and FEAR, FEAR, FEAR, everything and everyone. We are supposed to fear WWIII, Putin, nukes, starving, global warming aka climate change, too hot, too cold, too rainy, too much snow, too many tornados, too many people on earth! It’s working.

        Republicans are bad, nasty and wrong, Democrats are bad, nasty and wrong, white people are privileged and deserve to be harassed/bullied and ashamed for being white, black people need to be paid a million dollars each because their ancestors were brought to America as slaves and they are still going to be pissed about it because they are told to, daily! Brown people are paid to come to America to disrupt the lives of black and white people and the voting system, on purpose and use up the resources of tax dollars. While their children are exploited and God knows what all else (have mercy)! Christians are a threat to Liberals and LGBTQxyz…., Liberals are all going to hell, CRT, Juneteenth or July 4th (LOL), everyone is a threat to Democracy. Is he a man or woman, dog, cat, or nothing? Can you say he? Will you go to jail or be fined if that is not what he wants to be called today. Heck lets just shoot him/her/them/it or steal everything, no one will put you in jail anyway, right? It’s not cool to punish people for real crimes in America anymore, (unless your name is Trump) after all. I mean ole Joe in the White House will probably run on this stuff the next election, ‘cuz whose the highest authorized criminal in America? you got it. You think Ukraine has a war going on? Divided and conquered.

        Pushing Putin’s buttons by threatening his rightful borders through NATO using Ukraine is the fault of AMERICAN rotten/criminal politicians using our tax dollars. American politicians do NOT care how many Ukrainians get killed, they do NOT. Like Kamala Harris said “we have to reduce the population”. The purpose is to make us all slaves of the WEF. The ones of us that don’t get killed off. The USA and Russia are the powers standing in the way, there has to be a use for China because she has been left unfettered seemingly. We are all to become like China with far fewer people. They will euthanize their own population when commanded without blinking. They are not concerned about climate it is not needed to control their people, they are under control. Anyone not seeing this does not want to or is related to Pollyanna. Sorry. You can be simple or you can simply be.

        Don’t get me wrong. I am not worried because nothing is happening that God is not aware of. Believe it or not, this is His agenda not the World Economic Forums. All control belongs to him, the evil that is going on is Satanic but God only allows what is working for HIS greater glory. I know this because I know how it ends. I read the whole book. Oh, I know how it ends for me. Do you know how it ends for you?

        Liked by 2 people

      4. Tom Eberlin – “Russia invaded Ukraine. Just in case you didn’t know?”

        Tom, never waste a good crisis.

        After Boris Johnson scuttled that peace agreement, one website, Responsible Statecraft, said the quiet part out loud in their 9/2/22 story (Did Boris Johnson help stop a peace deal in Ukraine?):

        “Why did Western leaders want to stop Kyiv from signing a seemingly good deal with Moscow? Do they consider the conflict a proxy war with Russia?”

        Recently, King Charles hosted a reception at St. James Palace for some of the globalists attending the second annual Ukraine Recovery Conference, which took place in London, June 21-22, 2023.

        First held in July 2022, the conference is described as “designed to present the Ukrainian road map on the post-war reconstruction of Ukraine, as well as to discuss plans and raise funds for the reconstruction of Ukraine” (Wikipedia).

        Nice of Britain to host a reception and conference concerned with humanitarian healing and restoration when they, along with their U.S./NATO allies, are all trying to escalate a proxy war with a nuclear power.

        Vaccines are too darned inefficient for meeting population reduction goals.

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  10. Pingback: Viktor Orbán Warns Russia Wins Because They Are Nuclear

  11. It only makes sense, Leo, if you believe that the god of this world has deceived the power brokers into thinking that they have good intentions, the divine right of “kings.”

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    1. Amen. And has not all of this already been scripted as to fulfill biblical prophesies? Gog Magog et al. All the world’s a stage and men merely actors as Shakespeare said. This world holds nothing of value compared to the riches that await us in Christ Jesus.

      Liked by 1 person

  13. Do I agree with Hungary’s Prime Minister Viktor Orban ? In a word : YES ! Also, I agree that the BIG AGENDA = global depopulation : war, famine, pestilence, total control…..haven’t I read about this ?

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  14. Washington DC is NOT the stage. The WORLD is the stage, governments are the players, and they are ALL ON THE SAME TEAM. What team? The team attempting to kill off the vast majority of human beings on the planet.

    I suppose there is nothing we can do until Jesus comes back to throw the money changers out AGAIN.

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  15. Is anyone else seeing or hearing of a contingent of individuals that believe nukes are just another psyop. That all those nuclear tests and the bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were not actual nukes.

    I’ve not bothered to explore their rationale but, I’m seeing it popping up more and more on the various social media platforms.

    Liked by 1 person

    2. I avoid Social Media because it is full of people who just make things up . . . and others who think it is real . . . just laughable.
      Put down the Crack Pipe folks . . . .

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    3. I guess those persons have never been to Japan or Germany, Poland, France or Hawaii. People should travel to places where atrocities take place before commenting on them or coming up with the idea that they never took place. Speak to people who endured radiation poisoning of a loved one or watched someone’s face melt. Talk with someone who survived the Holocaust and understands real starvation, humiliation, rape by the enemy, forced labor and watching your child die under those conditions. Make a statement after your visit to Pearl Harbor and see the husks of battleship graves for hundreds of soldiers burned, shot, drowned in those watery tombs. There are still uncles and grandfathers who survived D-Day and huddled in muddy feces in dug outs.

      No wonder History is not taught anymore and ignorance abounds. Social Media its called… ignorance sharing for many. No D-Day is not a band, ask a grown up.

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  16. Pingback: Viktor Orbán speaks inconvenient truth: ‘Russia cannot be defeated because it is a nuclear power’ – Whatfinger Community

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